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Graves Motorsports AMA Championship Winning Motorcycle Exhausts and Accessories: Graves Motorsports

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post #1 of 301 (permalink) Old 12-29-2008, 05:52 PM Thread Starter
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Graves R1 Garage

Got a tech question on your R1? We'll do our best to help out.
Get technical info from the Graves Motorsports Staff and Race team. Occasionally one our own Race Team mechanics will step in and take on tech questions that can only be answered by the pros.

Lets keep this thread strictly R1 tech and we will get some questions answered. I will also be adding some standard technical advice that is relative to Graves products and/or just plain fun to talk about.


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post #2 of 301 (permalink) Old 12-29-2008, 06:00 PM
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Given the choice and what would you choose and why? A Yamaha Race ECU or a Power Commander, for a track only bike. 2007 model with some engine work done, race baffles etc.
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post #3 of 301 (permalink) Old 12-30-2008, 10:22 AM Thread Starter
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Race ECU or PC111?

Quote:
Originally Posted by W8nonu View Post
Given the choice and what would you choose and why? A Yamaha Race ECU or a Power Commander, for a track only bike. 2007 model with some engine work done, race baffles etc.

There are a few questions you have to ask yourself in this decision and the answers will either justify a Kit box or not.
The PC111 is the industry standard so if you go to any local dyno shop you can probably get a decent if not great fuel map for the bike. The Kit ECU kind of leaves it in your hands. I doubt you will have anyone in your surrounding area who is capable of tuning a Kit ECU while dynoing the motorcycle. It is a pretty intense unit with a significant learning curve.
So first question.
(Question 1) Can you tune this box or do you have someone knowledgeable enough on the box to tune it. If not you might open an expensive can of worms.
-Most of the time racers will run a kit box and PC111 so they can use the additional tuning specs of the kit box (throttle position, etc) but for tuning fuel and ign they will still use dynojet. Again it is a standard in the industry.
(Question 2) You might need to purchase both PC and kit box - does budget allow and is it worth it to you?
- For me to justify a kit box I believe you have to be at the top of your competition. If you are in a high level racing organization and running in the top 5 against a bunch of other racers with kit boxes then you will need that extra tool to tune the bike to that level. If you are not at this level then it might not be even noticable to you.
(Question 3) Are you in a racing position to justify the purchase of a kit ECU.

If any of these answers do not justify in full buying a kit box then I would strongly recommend getting a PC111 and ignition module and then spend the extra dough on a quality tune and some additional compression (cylinder pressure ;-)

Thanks, Taige
http://www.gravesport.com

Last edited by Graves 09; 12-30-2008 at 10:26 AM.
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post #4 of 301 (permalink) Old 12-30-2008, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Graves 09 View Post
There are a few questions you have to ask yourself in this decision and the answers will either justify a Kit box or not.
The PC111 is the industry standard so if you go to any local dyno shop you can probably get a decent if not great fuel map for the bike. The Kit ECU kind of leaves it in your hands. I doubt you will have anyone in your surrounding area who is capable of tuning a Kit ECU while dynoing the motorcycle. It is a pretty intense unit with a significant learning curve.
So first question.
(Question 1) Can you tune this box or do you have someone knowledgeable enough on the box to tune it. If not you might open an expensive can of worms.
-Most of the time racers will run a kit box and PC111 so they can use the additional tuning specs of the kit box (throttle position, etc) but for tuning fuel and ign they will still use dynojet. Again it is a standard in the industry.
(Question 2) You might need to purchase both PC and kit box - does budget allow and is it worth it to you?
- For me to justify a kit box I believe you have to be at the top of your competition. If you are in a high level racing organization and running in the top 5 against a buch of other racers with kit boxes then you will need that extra tool to tune the bike to that level. If you ae not at this level then it might not be even noticable to you.
(Question 3) Are you in a racing position to justify the purchase of a kit ECU.

If any of these answers do not justify in full buying a kit box then I would strongly recommend getting a PC11 and ignition module and then spend the extra dough on a quality tune and some additional compression (cylinder pressure ;-)

Thanks, Taige
http://www.gravesport.com
Thank you for your response and laying it out clearly. I have no need for a kit ECU
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post #5 of 301 (permalink) Old 12-30-2008, 05:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W8nonu View Post
Thank you for your response and laying it out clearly. I have no need for a kit ECU
wow, me either!

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post #6 of 301 (permalink) Old 02-02-2009, 06:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Graves 09 View Post
Got a tech question on your R1? We'll do our best to help out.
Get technical info from the Graves Motorsports Staff and Race team. Occasionally one our own Race Team mechanics will step in and take on tech questions that can only be answered by the pros.

Lets keep this thread strictly R1 tech and we will get some questions answered. I will also be adding some standard technical advice that is relative to Graves products and/or just plain fun to talk about.

Thanks, Taige

Graves Motorsports

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Phone (818)902-1942 ext 108
Fax (818)902-3821
taige@gravesport.com
http://www.gravesport.com

Will a YEC ecu work on a Street bike for Street use?
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post #7 of 301 (permalink) Old 02-03-2009, 11:29 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Will a YEC ecu work on a Street bike for Street use?
Yes, it will definitely function on the street and depending on the rider ability and tuning it could even benefit but before doing anything look at a couple of the posts I put up earlier in this thread. It explains some details on using the Kit box. Thanks, taige
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post #8 of 301 (permalink) Old 02-03-2009, 11:43 AM
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So the YEC box can be used just like the HRC ECU it sounds. Can you access the YEC ECU thru the stock harness?
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post #9 of 301 (permalink) Old 02-03-2009, 11:53 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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So the YEC box can be used just like the HRC ECU it sounds. Can you access the YEC ECU thru the stock harness?
You will need a YEC sub harness to bridge between the two but yes....
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post #10 of 301 (permalink) Old 02-03-2009, 12:08 PM
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Thanks!!
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post #11 of 301 (permalink) Old 05-11-2009, 10:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RC51killer View Post
Will a YEC ecu work on a Street bike for Street use?
No speedo or mileage takes some getting used to - fuel low still works..

Taige, I have a set of "standard lift" yec cams (not hight lift ones) for my 05 R1 that cant find much info on.

Whats the difference between my stock cams & standard lift yec cams (power wise) ?

Thanks Again - Mike

Last edited by FOZZ; 05-11-2009 at 10:24 PM.
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post #12 of 301 (permalink) Old 05-12-2009, 03:33 AM
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Hello Taige / Beau,

I want a full system for my 09R1, it's between Graves and the Akra Evo. How does Graves compare to the Akra?
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post #13 of 301 (permalink) Old 05-12-2009, 12:40 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crasher05 View Post
Hello Taige / Beau,

I want a full system for my 09R1, it's between Graves and the Akra Evo. How does Graves compare to the Akra?
Both companies build quality crafted products and Im glad to see that you are choosing between the best of the best. Spend the money and buy quality product and you are sure not to regret it. Buy cheap .... not so sure.

1st- and most important to me is power/torque and how it is delivered.

Again both systems make great power, and you cannot get perfect comparisons unless you do back to back dyno runs with each systems but our systems have shown a little higher results in most testing that I have seen or heard . Even more important is that they are very consistant and linear with no significant dips and valleys in the delivery. This takes a lot of design time , testing and tuning to eliminate these dips however they make a big difference when riding. Consistancy in power is very imporatant and I believe we have developed the most consistant power delivery in addition to excellent power.

2nd- weight savings
Our exhaust systems are the lightest in the industry. Our silencers have titanium entrance, exit caps and even the inner cores are Titanium.
For example our full Titanium High mounts systems for the 2009 R1 weigh in at a total of 11 lbs. That is piping, dual silencers and a all hardware. It is exactly half of the weight of the stock system and is the lightest that I have found. Removing weight is like gaining horsepower plus it significantly helps in the bikes handling.

3rd- Aesthetics and Sound
This is a tough one because everyone has there own opinion on this. What I can say is we have an exclusive way of packing our silencers which creates an extremely deep exhaust note. I personally do not like a high pitch, can sound to my exhaust. Not saying that Akras sound high pitch but I have heard many systems and nothing so far has given the deep exhaust pitch that ours does.
Aesthetics..........Both systems are good quality and nicely made but I like the fact that our silencers are a little smaller on the diameter and tuck away nicely under the tail. For me I like a simple no clutter bike and ours seems to offer that a little better.
Like I said you are choosing between 2 well made systems I just think we have the edge on power, weight, and sound. The looks is very personal so you will have to make that choice.
If you have any questions feel free to ask me. Thanks, taige

Last edited by Graves 09; 05-12-2009 at 12:50 PM.
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post #14 of 301 (permalink) Old 05-12-2009, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Graves 09 View Post
Both companies build quality crafted products and Im glad to see that you are choosing between the best of the best. Spend the money and buy quality product and you are sure not to regret it. Buy cheap .... not so sure.

1st- and most important to me is power/torque and how it is delivered.

Again both systems make great power but you will notice that our Dyno graphs not only make a little more overall HP but more importantly our power curves are very consistant and linear with no significant dips and valleys in the delivery. This takes a lot of design time , testing and tuning to eliminate these dips however they make a big difference when riding. Consistancy in power is very imporatant and I believe we have developed the most consistant power delivery in addition to more power.

2nd- weight savings
Our exhaust systems are the lightest in the industry. Our silencers have titanium entrance, exit caps and even the inner cores are Titanium.
For example our full Titanium High mounts systems for the 2009 R1 weigh in at a total of 11 lbs. That is piping, dual silencers and a all hardware. It is exactly half of the weight of the stock system and is the lightest that I have found. Removing weight is like gaining horsepower plus it significantly helps in the bikes handling.

3rd- Aesthetics and Sound
This is a tough one because everyone has there own opinion on this. What I can say is we have an exclusive way of packing our silencers which creates an extremely deep exhaust note. I personally do not like a high pitch, can sound to my exhaust. Not saying that Akras sound high pitch but I have heard many systems and nothing so far has given the deep exhaust pitch that ours does.
Aesthetics..........Both systems are good quality and nicely made but I like the fact that our silencers are a little smaller on the diameter and tuck away nicely under the tail. For me I like a simple no clutter bike and ours seems to offer that a little better.
Like I said you are choosing between 2 well made systems I just think we have the edge on power, weight, and sound. The looks is very personal so you will have to make that choice.
If you have any questions feel free to ask me. Thanks, taige
Thanks for that Taige, I'm in the UK i realy fancy going for your system over the Akra as i don't like to be a sheep! Everyone over here seems to use Akra but i have never seen a Graves system in the UK, why is that??
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post #15 of 301 (permalink) Old 05-12-2009, 01:52 PM
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When are you guys going to have some promotional "give-away's"???

2007 CANDY RED R1
GYT-R AIR FILTER/A&R RACE BAFFLES/GRAVES SMOG BLOCK-OFFS/FENDER ELIMINATOR/L.E.D. LIGHTING/HOTBODIES FLUSH MOUNTS/ Leo Vince Y-PIPE/TFI GEN 3/Cyko Toxic Rims/-2 front sprocket
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post #16 of 301 (permalink) Old 05-12-2009, 04:51 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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When are you guys going to have some promotional "give-away's"???

Well Im not suppose to say anything but rumor is we are having a promotional give away just as soon as they develop an all stainless steel
motorcycle that uses banana peels,a flux capacitor and 1.21 Gigawatts to travel back in time:-) lol

No Im Just playin,

As of now we do not really specialize in promotional give aways. We support in the ways we feel help more people than just the one prize winner. We developed our Works website to help racers get to the level they need to be to win races, we build quality parts, we tech people with all the effort we can.
Some companies spend more time on the promotional give aways then the product engineering. Its a bummer because one person gets a free exhaust and everyone else gets an inferior product. It doesn't make much sense.

I would however like to get some T-Shirts and wrist bands in here but that will be down the road. Thanks, taige
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post #17 of 301 (permalink) Old 05-14-2009, 08:42 AM
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Hello again Taige,

If i do buy the Graves system for my 09R1 should it be installed using the stock exhaust gaskets?
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post #18 of 301 (permalink) Old 05-14-2009, 10:40 AM
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Taige, thanks for all your help! My shortie Ti system is being delivered today, just in time for WSMC races this weekend! Thanks again!
Bengt
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post #19 of 301 (permalink) Old 05-14-2009, 10:47 AM
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Taige, I plan on going with a full exhaust, PCV, ignition module, smog block off plates an magnesium Marchesini rims. Any other easy ways to drop weight and/or add horsepower. Cams? Thinner head gaskets? Cam timing? Just trying to develop a long-term plan with this bike...
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post #20 of 301 (permalink) Old 05-14-2009, 12:14 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Hello again Taige,

If i do buy the Graves system for my 09R1 should it be installed using the stock exhaust gaskets?

If you want it mint then I would suggest getting a set of 4 news gaskets however..........
you can use the same gaskets and not have any problems. If they were torqued on a bunch of times or the bike had a ton of miles then i would say get news OEM gaskets but that is probably not the case with yours. You could flip them over for a fresh crush on the gasket. Thanks, Taige
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