How do you slow down? Downshift first or brake? - Yamaha R1 Forum: YZF-R1 Forums
Technique & Riding Want to kneescrape? Go faster in corners? Smoother riding? Anything about how to ride goes in here please.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 01:11 PM Thread Starter
I eat my R1. :)
 
gnuwolf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 36
How do you slow down? Downshift first or brake?

Hi guys,

I'm just wondering which is better when trying to slow down to take a corner on a race track?

Downshift first then brake or the other way around?

If downshift first, how much stress does the clutch and gearbox can take?

Thanks.

Cheers!
gnuwolf is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 01:18 PM
Owner of the color changing R1
 
R1nStang's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Allen, TX
Posts: 16,215
I blip the throttle while downshifting



R1-015 `Ghostrider` Squadron

Competition Werkes slipons, Leo Ypipe, PCV, -1/+1 520 conversion, Flashtune.
R1nStang is online now  
post #3 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 01:25 PM
R1 Forum Star
 
z064life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 16,012
On the brakes last...but that doesn't mean you won't be downshifting as well..just depends how many gears you need to go down, but you will want to be applying brakes to allow for trail braking into the corner.

Hey Greenstreak, it's z064life lazy ass

Phantom Squadron XO - http://www.r1-forum.com/forums/50-r1-012-%60phantom-squadron%60/
z064life is offline  
post #4 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 01:46 PM
The Lead Farmer
 
Meister37's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Indy area
Posts: 25,281
Quote:
Originally Posted by z064life View Post
On the brakes last...but that doesn't mean you won't be downshifting as well..just depends how many gears you need to go down, but you will want to be applying brakes to allow for trail braking into the corner.
Um, no. Brake like hell while you're downshifting. utilize both braking forces at once. Motor to slow the rear, binders for the front. Blip to get the motor closer to the speed of the tire.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fikays View Post
Kirk is a total dick.
Meister37 is offline  
post #5 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 01:52 PM
I RACE U LOSE
 
quick kurt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Philly now Langhorne Pa.
Posts: 3,919
Send a message via Yahoo to quick kurt
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meister37 View Post
Um, no. Brake like hell while you're downshifting. utilize both braking forces at once. Motor to slow the rear, binders for the front. Blip to get the motor closer to the speed of the tire.
Thats how I do it,but what do I know.

'06 50th GYT-R CarbonSlipons,Akra Y Graves stacks,blockoffs,covers BMCair Bazzaz Zafm Zfi mapsw Vortex w/520ERV3 Shogun sliders Vortex rearsets Renthal med.comp Ballistic12cell Stompgrip CRG levers Galfer SBK fr&rr rotors ProboltTi'12 50th WGP#145. Graves full Ti carbon ex,stacks,blockoffs BMCair Yosh case,oilfill,yokenut,axleblocks Renthal w/520ERV3 CRG RC2's Watsen's Shogun framesliders Renthal med.comp Ballistic8cell ProboltTi Lucky 13th R1-013Squadron Member
quick kurt is offline  
post #6 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 01:55 PM
The Lead Farmer
 
Meister37's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Indy area
Posts: 25,281
Quote:
Originally Posted by quick kurt View Post
Thats how I do it,but what do I know.
You must be just like me, a know nothing douche nozzle! Weeeeeeee.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fikays View Post
Kirk is a total dick.
Meister37 is offline  
post #7 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 02:24 PM
ROWDY
 
Stonewall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 11,854
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meister37 View Post
You must be just like me, a know nothing douche nozzle! Weeeeeeee.
No Track but on the roads I run, I don't use my brakes very much. Since I had the ECU flashed, with the 09 It has just enough engine breaking along with downshifting into the correct gear prior to the curve that most of the time I don't use any brakes.

ROWDY

Last edited by Stonewall; 08-06-2012 at 02:40 PM.
Stonewall is offline  
post #8 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-09-2012, 09:01 AM
I eat my R1
 
SoloStunna99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stonewall View Post
No Track but on the roads I run, I don't use my brakes very much. Since I had the ECU flashed, with the 09 It has just enough engine breaking along with downshifting into the correct gear prior to the curve that most of the time I don't use any brakes.


I'm with you, who needs brakes anyway....? lol

STOLEN - '04 CBR1000rr
STOLEN - '04 GSXR1000
SOLD - '05 R1
SOLD - track whore - '08 CBR1000RR
SOLD - '09 R1
track whore - '11 r1 (flashed ECU)
SoloStunna99 is offline  
post #9 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-11-2012, 06:23 PM
Just made this great wheelie.. did you see it?!
 
R1Teal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: ON, Canada
Posts: 76
On the brakes first (front only), then blip and downshift as many times as required. It is not wise to rely on engine braking to slow down.

Most of my local race/lapping track is ran while in 2nd gear but check out the braking at the ends of the two consecutive straights to see what I mean.

http://youtu.be/qwWMgubUT_0
R1Teal is offline  
post #10 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-12-2012, 08:49 AM
I eat my chicken stripes
 
Chop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Athens/ (GReece)
Posts: 1,973
Send a message via MSN to Chop
When i brake hard i use both breaks and downshifting a couple or 3 gears, but normally use breaks and then downshift to keep the engine from stalling.

R1 2008 Graphite Grey
PP Tuning Rearsets GP // Power Commander 3 // Race Baffles // LeoVince Y Pipe // MRA DB Screen // Pillion Cowl // Pazzo shorties // stainless steel rear lines // Ohlins front Springs+Oil // Fiberglass body custom painted // Dunlop GP Racer 211
http://www.yamahafz1oa.com/forum/images/smilies/rmwl2.gif
Trackday fotos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQ3JL...feature=digest

and
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GO0px...eature=channel
Chop is offline  
post #11 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-28-2012, 06:12 PM
For no ma'am
 
Treemugger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: A Murica
Posts: 2,167
I assume your talking about a straight into a slow corner. How can you downshift if you're near max revs like you should be if your going 10/10ths? Brake like hell and blip to match revs on the way down is the simplest way i can put it.

http://imgur.com/VJLeJyK
Treemugger is offline  
post #12 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-28-2012, 07:08 PM
My R1 eats me.
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2
I think it will depend of your speed before entering the corner . Personally I do think that i caress the brake more often than shifting down first specially in fast corners . Why ? simple you are always trying to drift a bit while maintaining stability and cornering speed . One of the best way to do it is to slow the front end just a little bit more than the rear before shifting it down and get the rear wheel spinning slightly on the gas. At very low speed you just shift down as you make sure there will be no issue with your transmission .
baroc is offline  
post #13 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-28-2012, 07:50 PM
I eat my R1
 
JgorinacR1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: PSL, FL
Posts: 777
So I've always wondered, does engine breaking put a lot of stress on your engine over the years? Just was always curious, I do it regardless because it feels so natural to do..
JgorinacR1 is offline  
post #14 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-28-2012, 10:16 PM
I eat my R1
 
Racer Dude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: The Ghey Area
Posts: 4,714


I don't ride my bike on the track, but if I did, I would brake, blip and downshift all simultaneously.

The purpose of blipping (as was already mentioned) is to match the wheel speed with the engine speed, as to not lock up the rear tire. The reason for doing this all simultaneously, is to shorten your braking zone (hense quicker lap times).

Riders that are fast on a closed racing course, brake very, very hard at the end of a fast straight, into a tight, slow corner, all the while they are blipping and downshifting at the same time.

If you're asking this question, (no disrespect) you shouldn't be taking a liter bike out on track. A riding school would also be in order.



Peace.





Bogie is the man, and I should learn not to mess with him
Racer Dude is offline  
post #15 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-28-2012, 10:20 PM
I eat my R1
 
Racer Dude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: The Ghey Area
Posts: 4,714


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chop View Post

When i brake hard i use both breaks and downshifting a couple or 3 gears, but normally use breaks and then downshift to keep the engine from stalling.


Yo homie, it's spelled "brakes"







Bogie is the man, and I should learn not to mess with him
Racer Dude is offline  
post #16 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-28-2012, 10:42 PM
Older and faster
 
grommet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Wichita KS
Posts: 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Racer Dude View Post
brake very, very hard at the end of a fast straight, into a tight, slow corner, all the while they are blipping
It is very difficult to be braking at max and blip the throttle at the same time. Even more to trail off the brakes after lean-in if you're still doing this.

I'm in the downshift and ease the clutch out without blipping while applying brakes with the greatest amount of control camp. Keeping it simple, fewer variables, and it still has the similar effect of helping slow you down.
grommet is offline  
post #17 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-29-2012, 12:36 AM
I eat my R1
 
Racer Dude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: The Ghey Area
Posts: 4,714


I don't track my bike, so I'll take your word for it


I suppose if you braked hard enough before downshifting, the engine speed would be low enough to not lock up the rear.







Bogie is the man, and I should learn not to mess with him
Racer Dude is offline  
post #18 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-29-2012, 12:44 AM
Older and faster
 
grommet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Wichita KS
Posts: 17
The key to not sliding the tire is easing the clutch out very gently. Make your own slipper by learning this.
grommet is offline  
post #19 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-29-2012, 12:55 AM
My R1 eats me.
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 1
Make sure you are as "one" with the bike as possible and use as much of your ass and legs as possible to anchor yourself to your bike. You should already have your ass a bit to the side in the seat. Dont take all the braking forces with your arms.

Dont SLAM the brakes but squeeze firmly. Just to let the front end suspension take the first hit without bottoming out. After that initial firm squeeze, give the brakes all the pressure you dare to. If you are going in fast, you can probably brake 100% without lifting the rear or overloading the front. Try to keep that hard pressure as long as you can, but as the speed goes down you will have to take a little pressure off the brakes when you feel the rear lift too much or the front loosing traction.

The important part is to brake HARD from the beginning of braking and after that try to only brake less and less to find the correct entry speed for the corner and only have very little braking being done after the turn-in. By braking like this it is easy to feel and use the traction. Adding MORE brake pressure near the end of braking is more risky as you "burn the candle in both ends".

This is a video from one of my track days. The interesting thing is the G-force graphs where you can see exactly how hard I am braking. It might not be 100% in sync but you will get my point.

Go to 6.40 minutes in, that is the longest straight on one of my fastest laps.

Hansi is offline  
post #20 of 64 (permalink) Old 08-29-2012, 09:33 AM
My R1 eats me.
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 2
Brakes or down shift

I hate to state the obvious but one is called brakes and one is a transmission.
Brake pads are easy to replace. Clutch plates are harder and transmissions are even harder and cost a lot more. Lose your front or rear brakes you van limp home. Lose a clutch or tyranny and not going to happen.

I race an R1 powered D-Sport racer in SCCA. I ride a Yamaha Venture. Use the brakes to slow both vehicles. Use the transmissions yo put power on the ground.
poland68 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Yamaha R1 Forum: YZF-R1 Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
downshift problem kearly1cat 04-06 R1 Mechanical Help 0 02-22-2011 11:03 AM
clicking from front brake area at very slow speed sanaga 09-14 R1 Mechanical Help 3 08-26-2009 07:29 PM
HELP: Slow speed skid: front brake broke and all electronics wont work madlz Mechanical / Help 2 06-23-2008 07:51 PM
draggin the rear brake to slow it down? latemp Stunters Corner 4 11-18-2007 10:24 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome