Ruined by track day?

June 18th I took a race class. I was dog-slow compared to everyone else, but I was much faster than I have ever been in my life. Since then, I have only ridden about 200-250 miles on the street. I have literally had dreams about the track, but have lost much of my enthusiasm for the street (besides, a bunch of my buddies went down this summer). So have many of you guys had this same experience? Also, the R1 was too much bike for me (at least for a first track session). I broke the back end loose coming out of a tight leftie on my third or fourth lap of the day. The track was wet and I ham-fisted the throttle. Next lap I got target-fixated in the same corner and went off-course. Fortunately I saved it both times, but it pretty much shot the crap out of my confidence for the rest of the day. It was only the last 5-8 laps or so I finally loosened up and wasn't all panicked at that corner. My question: if the bike is too much for me at the track, wouldn't it follow that it is too much for me on the street? I haven't been down on the street in a lotta years (knock wood), but that is mainly due to the fact that I tip-toe through corners that other guys are hitting 20-40MPH faster than me. I guess it is mainly ego that prevents me from getting a smaller bike for my main squeeze (been on liter bikes for the last 12 years). Man, I just want to be back on the track... I just don't want to throw my R1 down the track (which I feel is a major inhibiting factor for me in regard to entry speed and such).

pussy

No just the opposite. On the street you can afford to ride a bigger bike because it is not all about latebraking, getting on the gas early, backing it in, hanging one cheek off, etc. On the street, whats more important are rollons at speed, and those are just more comfortable on a big bike. You have the right attitude about saving it for the track. The track is where you search for the bikes potential so many of us can max ourselves out on a smaller bike.

i do not ride the street like I do the track too much sand............ ok maybe just a little bit..................... :crash

Well, i ride the shit out of it on street etc, off course within the limits. But on tracks i see i could go a bit faster here and there but my technique and my handling don't allow it. When i'm pushin it, sliding the rear in etc i'm right on the limit which i shouldn't be at when i would 'control' the bike enough. I think it will stay too much bike for anyone unless they do trackdays 1-2 days a week a least.

if you want to sale it i will trade you my 96 zx6r and we can call it equal lol have fun ride safe on the track and on the street

I don't think the track has ruined street riding for me... I just ride much more conservative on the street now because I realize that it will never compare to what I can do on the track... The track allows me to safely push my limits, so I don't have to try them on the street where it is infinitely more dangerous... I did buy an r6 track bike because the ONE is WAY too much for me to try and keep on the track... - BA

Originally posted by No_6 June 18th I took a race class. I was dog-slow compared to everyone else, but I was much faster than I have ever been in my life. Since then, I have only ridden about 200-250 miles on the street. I have literally had dreams about the track, but have lost much of my enthusiasm for the street (besides, a bunch of my buddies went down this summer). So have many of you guys had this same experience? Also, the R1 was too much bike for me (at least for a first track session). I broke the back end loose coming out of a tight leftie on my third or fourth lap of the day. The track was wet and I ham-fisted the throttle. Next lap I got target-fixated in the same corner and went off-course. Fortunately I saved it both times, but it pretty much shot the crap out of my confidence for the rest of the day. It was only the last 5-8 laps or so I finally loosened up and wasn't all panicked at that corner. My question: if the bike is too much for me at the track, wouldn't it follow that it is too much for me on the street? I haven't been down on the street in a lotta years (knock wood), but that is mainly due to the fact that I tip-toe through corners that other guys are hitting 20-40MPH faster than me. I guess it is mainly ego that prevents me from getting a smaller bike for my main squeeze (been on liter bikes for the last 12 years). Man, I just want to be back on the track... I just don't want to throw my R1 down the track (which I feel is a major inhibiting factor for me in regard to entry speed and such). Much of what you feel/describe is true for me and i'm sure a few others out there. I have been in a funk ever since totalling my R1 on july 6th @ my own tk-dy and to this day i'm still not 100% certain about my next bike but probably one of these (zx6r or zx10) simply because i've had numerous bikes i wanna try something Orange, hehe, and to add to my dilemma i'm not sure which to ride (track or street exclusively) as my experience with the R1 still lingers. Don't feel bad because of you've exercised your better judgement when riding with your buds and they go a bit deeper into the next corner! your thoughts about your own mortality have stepped into view and its hard to deal with at times i know. BD

This is normal. I have said many times that once you start doing track days, riding aggressively on the street will NEVER have the same appeal it once did. I am VERY conservative on the street. Given a rider of sufficient skill and experience, I also agree that a liter bike makes the better street bike. Your track riding learning curve will be sped up with a smaller displacement bike as compared to a liter track bike. So a 600 on the track and the R1 for the street is a great combination. None of the above is intended to apply to new and inexperienced riders.

I agree, it just isn't the same once you've been on a track. I did the FAST school last August and while I still ride quick on the streets, it just isn't the same. When you are on the track, its just you and the track(and a few other guys if you are slow enough:p ). No oncoming cars, no dogs, no sand, no pot holes (occaisional sealer stips though), and no telephone poles. Unfortunately, the nearest decent track is 5-6 hours away, so I have to make my peace with the street. In some ways the track school made me a faster rider, but in other ways it opened my eyes to what is acceptable risk on the street. Riding on the street at the speed and lean angles you do on the track is an unacceptable risk. Once your eyes are opened, you are never as carefree on the street again.:cryin

Originally posted by Eyespy None of the above is intended to apply to new and inexperienced riders. Hey Eye is this your disclaimer?;) BD

BD, you've seen the list of disclaimers I once posted a while back, right?

R1 for the street. Track days have cancelled my interest in hard street riding. The benefit of track days is that I get all that aggressive riding finished on the track and I then enjoy a nice, rural ride with no worries of law infractions. 250cc for the track please

Originally posted by Eyespy BD, you've seen the list of disclaimers I once posted a while back, right? Mmmmmm, my memory has :vanish BD

Did my third yesterday and I cant wait untl next Sunday. I corrected(saved?) my first near high side early in the day, bike got loose as I was coming out of turn one, shook pretty hard, scotts did its job, I DIDN'T panic, did one more lap and then went in and talked to a racer/instructor about the experience, finally after 18 years of riding, experienced what I had seen only others deal with on tracks or t.v.! THE DAY GOT BETTER AFTER THAT. Right now, according to one of the instructors, I am fast enough and under control enough to run in the advanced, its fun and I just try to not get lapped. I always talk to the racers after each session and get feedback on my lines, if I was handling myself correctly, etc. and they are always helpful. Sorry about the long post, I am very enthusiastic about this sport and I think my fiance is tired of hearing about race tires, entering turns late, etc.

Originally posted by bpa00 I don't think the track has ruined street riding for me... I just ride much more conservative on the street now because I realize that it will never compare to what I can do on the track... The track allows me to safely push my limits, so I don't have to try them on the street where it is infinitely more dangerous... I did buy an r6 track bike because the ONE is WAY too much for me to try and keep on the track... - BA :iamwithst :yesnod

Good posts! Keep 'em coming. And Kai... :p :p :p :p :p :p and for good measure: :finger :lol

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Holy sheiot Hanna! I shoulda just said yeah i remembered them.:yesnod BD

eye yer on crack dude

No_6 your thread has just been jacked!

and back to the topic of track days.. do you guys feel the track is a good place to start riding street bikes?

Nope. BD

any reason as to why? seems like it would be good, no cars, animals or any other things like that.

Originally posted by Outlaw13 any reason as to why? seems like it would be good, no cars, animals or any other things like that. Very true but no matter what the persons age may be the very basic essential skills for learning to ride and maneuver a bike must or should be verbalized as well as demonstrated. Theres far too many 'how comes' & 'why's to just sit someone on a bike and let them sink or swim. BD

i see.. thanks for the info

Originally posted by No_6 Also, the R1 was too much bike for me (at least for a first track session). I broke the back end loose coming out of a tight leftie on my third or fourth lap of the day. The track was wet and I ham-fisted the throttle. Next lap I got target-fixated in the same corner and went off-course. Fortunately I saved it both times, but it pretty much shot the crap out of my confidence for the rest of the day. It was only the last 5-8 laps or so I finally loosened up and wasn't all panicked at that corner. Hey No 6, I guess you hung the tail out a bit huh? What did you do to save it? Did you let up on the throttle? Maintained throttle and just rode it out without panicking? And what did you think of how you responded? I am intrigued by the track but am wondering what traffic is like. I know everybody is different but how is visibility of people around you? Do you know when somebody is going to pull an aggressive move to pass or is it sometimes unexpected? I know on the street, I try and check my mirrors all the time but I still don't have that great a picture of what is going on behind me. I thought the R6 mirrors sucked, you don't even want to know about the Ducati's. A band aid of sorts is just to take off at lights like the cops are chasing you.

To answer your first question, I grabbed throttle, as I was exiting the corner. As the bike came up, the back broke loose and started fishtailing. I backed off a little on the throttle and rode it out, keeping as straight a line as I could. It happenned so quickly, that the sequence is questionable. I just know that I grabbed too much throttle, or wasn't smooth enough rolling on. EYESPY or BD, you have some idea of exactly what happenned? Keep in mind: wet track, doing about 30mph at the exit of a hairpin lefty, level at the exit but the corner is on a slight downhill slope. Pretty flat, no banking. On the next question, sometimes you have no idea who is behind you. I sometimes take quick looks behind me, but I don't think that is the best idea. Mirrors are off the bike, as you don't want tiny shards of glass all over the track. Basically, as a beginner, you stick to the middle of the track, leaving the best lines for the faster riders... and you stay CONSISTANT and PREDICTABLE (as much as possible) so that they may pass you with complete impunity. And they do. I agree with taking off at the lights, but the R1's mirrors are pretty good, so on the street, I keep one eye pointed backwards.

No. 6 , I agree with what I hear here that the R1 is to much on the track but as far as the backend breaking loose in one or two turns I would be more interested in what kind of tires you are running . OEM Dunlops slid all over the track for me , then a set of Michelen Pilots slid a little less , then Pirrelli Super Corsa's and I still havent slid ! Tire pressure and temp could also play a part . :)

The track is the only place i ride.I rode on the street for 12 years and did a track day in 98 and was hooked.Gave up street riding last year all together.You simply cannot replicate the feeling of the track on the strett...period end of story.The track is way safer and it will bring your bad street riding habits to the surface quickly....

You have to try and not worry about the riders around you... Never look back... It is the faster riders job to make a safe pass... If you are the faster rider, then you need to make a safe pass and not "stuff" anyone.... - BA

yes... it's the faster riders job to pass at the right place.. and safely... you just ride your lines.. and try not to do anything unpredictable.. there is also a flagger that will let you know when you are geting lapped... Not that I would know from personal experiance or anything :D :lol

Very irresponsible of me but I cane the crap out of my bikes on the street... Not down the main shopping street of course but the open country roads where it is safe'ish...... Not been to a track day yet.... Not on a Bike anyhow.... Did Silverstone in a Ferrari F355 as a pressy from my girl, all the time I was thinking Hmmm this would be a sh!t load of fun on my bike..... :thumbup

I was on stock tires very near the end of their life... I had 4,000 miles on 'em by the end of the day. After the track day, the back end would break loose at the drop of a hat. NOT fun.

Well I wasnt' going to say anything but I guess I will now. I was with N0_6 on this day and I actually got to follow him cuz I wanted video of it. :D. One of the best things about riding track days is learning how the bike reacts to things, IE in No_6's case when he gased it to much out of Turn 4 and the bike steped out. It's not a place to ride 9/10ths or even 10/10ths, it's about learning what the bike does. There are very few people out there that can ride the R1 to it's limit's if we could we would all be on the AMA circuit. My take on all of this is that the track is about learning and just how far the bike can go that way if you need it on the street you can use it. How many people do you see that ride twisties and have no idea what they are doing, the track helps teach you speically if you take a course. No_6, the best advice I can say is that if you want get a track bike and learn what you can and can't do, and just use the R1 as a fun toy on the street but don't ride out side of your comfort zone.

I feel better. :) I'm glad I have the One for the street. I'd feel like such a whuss stepping 'down' to a 600.

Originally posted by No_6 I feel better. :) I'm glad I have the One for the street. I'd feel like such a whuss stepping 'down' to a 600. Dont' feel that way, I have told people many times that our local track is not a HP track and that it's a lot of work running the R1 on it. If you remember seeing post's on our site out me getting my novice license there is a reason, this is it. I want to hang it out more but don't want to trash my R1 so a track bike is what I need and if I race it to then that's ok.

Originally posted by No_6 I was on stock tires very near the end of their life... I had 4,000 miles on 'em by the end of the day. After the track day, the back end would break loose at the drop of a hat. NOT fun. Theres a few factors involved here that could have or did lead to your near highside. 1) tires,tires,tires. tk-dys are not a place to skimp on tires, meaning fresh or as close to it as affordably possible. 2) Its quite obvious the wet or damp track played a roll in this near highside and even if you had new tires i don't suspect it would have made little or no diff. 3) Tire PSI is a critical component as well. 4) throttle control is also a critical area especially when wet and even though you were straight up you can't put the gorilla-nuts to it without some kinda of wheel spin.:fact BD

No_6 I have done a fair amount of track days and the oem D208 ZR tires get way too hot. The 207RR's work great! I can come out of a 3rd gear corner at full lean going 90+ and open the throttle all the way after the apex and never have a concern about the rear. They do take a couple of laps to fully warm up but after that they are some of the best tires I have ever tried. About the track question though, you guys have a different perception than I do. The R1 kicks ass on the track. The track seems to absorb the power where on the street it is a lot more noticeable that I have 140 bhp pushing me around. I find myself looking for more power on the track where the on the street I seem to have all the power I could ever want. Just off the subject a little, I do like riding smaller bikes on the track though, hella corner speed. There is one guy that has a nsr with a banshee motor inside and he WILL lap any bike out there, god he carries some corner speed.

Free bump,... I'm learning alot from this topic hoping some other people have some good things to share, as i myself am saving up for a good 2 day track school.

Big Daddy, July 6 was a shitty day.. I highsided at about 85 and ripped my left shoulder out by about 3" It took me about 3 weeks before I could ride hard again, and the first trackday was spent building my nerve back up.. Now I'm faster than I was before the crash, but, I had to just tell myself that it happens and just move on...

You can buy my track bike No. 6 as for a good deal or I will fix it and sell if for whatever I put into it. I'm getting something else to play with ;)

I'm down for the good deals!

Originally posted by Eyespy This is normal. I have said many times that once you start doing track days, riding aggressively on the street will NEVER have the same appeal it once did. I am VERY conservative on the street. Given a rider of sufficient skill and experience, I also agree that a liter bike makes the better street bike. Your track riding learning curve will be sped up with a smaller displacement bike as compared to a liter track bike. So a 600 on the track and the R1 for the street is a great combination. None of the above is intended to apply to new and inexperienced riders. Great respone, couldn't have put it better. What are you doin readin my mind Eyespy :D

I took a race school this past summer and have no love for the track. I got forced into the advanced group and ended up being the 2nd fastest of the day. I hated it.... same turn over and over, no suprises, nothing to think about... I dunno, I love the freedom of the street I guess. On the street you can go anywhere, at any time, at any speed you want... you got nothing to proove, no one coming up on you and scaring the crap outta you... and best of all riding on the street is free... as opposed to $200+ for a few sessions on a track. I guess everyone is different. Whatever you decide, have fun (thats what its all about anyway right??) and be safe :thumbup

Originally posted by R6 Matt I took a race school this past summer and have no love for the track. I got forced into the advanced group and ended up being the 2nd fastest of the day. I hated it.... same turn over and over, no suprises, nothing to think about... I dunno, I love the freedom of the street I guess. On the street you can go anywhere, at any time, at any speed you want... you got nothing to proove, no one coming up on you and scaring the crap outta you... and best of all riding on the street is free... as opposed to $200+ for a few sessions on a track. I guess everyone is different. Whatever you decide, have fun (thats what its all about anyway right??) and be safe :thumbup Matt its a shame you were forced into a situation you had no business in as it left you with a negative result and thats too bad. A school or regular tk-dy should be one of feeling comfortable as opposed to the later. I understand your position with regard to the repetative nature of the track BUT that is the essence of being on the track as you get to hone your skills by virtue of continually doing laps over the same turns. And yes everyone is different thats what makes life for each of us.:hellobye BD

ok street riding has got me pretty freaked lately and i want to try out some tracks anybody know where i could go in NJ shore area its alright if it s a couple hrs away...thanks

I did 5 track days last year on my YZF600R. T-hill is a drive for me and I found driving up the nite b4 was best to be fresh. I don't recomend 2days back to back-try spread them out a coupla weeks because a full day is a workout and it takes 2 days to recover [oh yeah- Im old@42]. Cali has several tracks spread around with decent scheds. The first lap I was very wary of a fast rider blowing my doors off-but the track boss did a single file for 5 laps @50-75 to get us up to speed. In the novice/C group the hard corners are no-pass and getting passed on the straights later in the day was not to bad. I even did some passing myself.:p The 600 has been a fine track bike-only showing limits on the long straights where the R1s are walking away from me. Speedo was taped-maybe 130 tops and lap times at 2:40. I have also done Sears. It was a sometimes foggy day and I rarely was in 6 gear-still good fun. This yr=seca/willow big track/ontario? Check motorcycleridesinamerica.com:thumbup I got hooked by the Yam dealer for an R1 in Oct. that now has some local runs to gain familiarity-ready for spring.....:D props to PTT and Code for a fun year-happy holidays all.

Originally posted by tidbit pussy :iamwithst I tip toe through corners too :lol

the big D took the other

No_6, Dude, you had all the excuses in the world to highside that R1, but you didn't, you saved it. That means something. Githyself to a DRY track ASAP with DOT Race Tyres! You will be amazed! The R1 can run with 600s because it is such a smooth power delivery. Just concentrate on being smooooooooth. You'll be fine. In the wet on an R1, you have to be exceptionally smooth. Remember - Stock Tyres (4K mi!) + Wet Track + R1 = It's amazing that you are still here! Get some better tires and get back on a DRY track. Oh yeah, do one of the schools (STAR or Code; I really enjoyed STAR). Don't second guess yourself, sounds like you did fine considering the conditions.