2nd Gear Wheelies - A stale subject maybe but...

...I still can't get 'em to happen. In 1st gear I don't have a great deal of trouble getting the front wheel off the ground. I've experimented with both the "clutching" and "throttle-on / throttle-off methods - I too seem to prefer the clutch. My lack of experience / nerve prevents me from getting very high and I'm still intimidated by the "touchiness" in 1st gear. So, I've been working on the 2nd gear thing. Little to no success thus far. After reviewing every post on the subject (thanks everyone!), here's where I'm at. In 2nd gear @ ~40-45 MPH (4000 to 5000 RPM maybe) I 2 finger the clutch, rev the bike to ~6500 - 7000 RPM and release the clutch (i've tried both the "dumping" and "fast progressive release" techniques). Still all I'm getting is the hard pull forward. The front wheel does get a little light, but rarely is there any air.... Damn! I'm thinkin' my problems may be two fold: I'm not sure I'm leaning back far enough (if at all). Is this an important part of making the 2nd gear thing happen? At 6'0"", 180lbs. I didn't think I'd have to help the bike along too much....? Is there a way I can get-comfortable-with / practice leaning back w/o actually attempting a wheelie? Hmmmm? Also, from 4500 RPM I'm revving the bike to ~6500 or 7000 then letting go of the clutch as the RPMs trail off. Perhaps its the "chicken shit factor", but I'm not continuing to accellerate through the 7000 Rs. Is this something I need to work on? Or should it be enough just to get it to 7000 and let go of the clutch? Maybe it just needs more than 7k? Apologies for beating this dead horse some more, but I'd really get the feel for this. Your help is much appreciated - A.

give more RPM's.. while dumping the clutch.. give throttle. You'll be airborn fast.. You're just chickening out. I wheelied my 133rwhp.. R1 in 4th.. sitting down.. no clutch.

sounds like your chickening out to me also. your throttle control is really important when trying to ride wheelies, if your not smooth with it your just gonna lose your momentum. Your first have to get comfortable with the set point(the point where it feel's like your gonna flip over backwards) once you get that point ease off the throttle very littleand it will be balanced, then you start giving her, but you dont want to be choppy on the throttle try to make everything smooth as possible,it takes alot of practice and probaly a rear tire. And remember cops frown upon any kind of wheelies I just got nailed yesterday and it sucks.

Alex, I'm in the same boat. I can get the wheel like two feet of the ground consistently using the same technique as you. When I it comes off the ground fast and high on occasion it takes me by total surprise. I'll post back in every now and then to let you know how I'm doing. You do the same and when we make progress we can help eachother along. -Lokes

As the other guys have said, you need to be a bit more brutal. Pop the clutch out quicker, and use more revs. If you can get it off the floor by 2 feet, then next time use more revs. Takes a bit of practise. I tend to clutch them up in 2nd at around 60mph. Dunno what revs that is as my rev counter is knackered.

i am surprised at all the fear about first gear wheelies on the R1. i personally found that learning in 1st was a lot less frightening than 2nd. i can now, at anytime, ride a 1st gear wheelie all the way to redline (which doesn't take long). even though 1st comes up really fast, you're not going very fast so its much easier to control. i can find the balance point in 1st easy. as far as 2nd gear, i usually clutch up at around 52-4 mph and one finger the clutch while giving a little throttle. i have no problem getting it up but have trouble with the speed being able to sense the balance point. i looped my 01 r1 but that was a mistake because i had done hundreds of them in 2nd on that bike with no trouble. with this 02 i think in the back of my mind i'm still a little scared because i don't ride them as long as on the 01. ithink i'm afraid of flipping again, how do you get over that sensation???

BaddaZZ---what happened when you flipped??? was it just too much throttle? Did you just lose concentration? What are your words of wisdom for us "grasshoppers"??:D :D :D

So, you just literally Pop the clutch....sit in 2nd gear ...60mph or so...pull in the clutch, and just Pop it?...I have read every post as well, and there are many different peoples styles to pull from...i just cant seem to grasp this... when im feelin cocky on my 1st gear wheelies...i go to 2nd n try pullin her up... do you guys ...lets see, how do yah say this...do yah *whack* the clutch...like this:... roll the throttle easy, when she gets to about 5 K, gas it, and just snap the clutch in and out?...is This the technique for wheelies?....kinda like when youre racing someone, and you just hold the throttle wide open quickly snappin the clutch and shifting....this is how i have been trying to get the front end up, but i have been whackin her around 5K....all i get is a jerk...what im afraid of happening is getting overzealous and standing it straight up... hmmm.....I WILL learn how to do this......:rock

I have found that I have trouble getting the front tire up high at 60mph. It must be technique. At about 42-45mph it comes up fast. Frustrating. The skin on my finger is gone from the clutch lever hitting it so many times. LOL

drizay, i think what happened is i held the clutch just a little too long (a little is all it takes on an r1) while i was giving it throttle and the extra revs caused the bike to shoot stright up in the air. all wheelies but especially clutch wheelies are about timing. your timing has to be right or a. the bike won't come up how you want it, or b. the bike will come up too fast and you'll lose it. what i did when i was learning to pop the clutch is i concentrated on the technique, not getting the bike up so high. i just wanted to get the routine down. i.e. speed, rpm, balance, body position, etc. then i concentrated on the actual clutch throttle action. but i did not attempt to get the bike real high, i just wanted enough throttle to lift the bike so i knew my timing and sequence was correct. once i could get the bike to lift whenever i wanted, i began to give it a touch more throttle to get it higher. when i was comfy i would add a little more and more and so on. soon i could get it up high enough to ride it a little ( starting at 52-4 mph i was coming down around 90-105). thats not very long by good wheeliers standards but you have to go slow at your own pace or disaster strikes. don't let anyone push you and don't get so frustrated that you try too much. be patient. soon you will have your timing and it will begin to fall in place. finding the balance point on an r1 is tricky cause it is so high and YOU WILL feel like your going to flip. kinda like the bike is floating. once there just back off a little and work hard on your throttle control. that's what i'm doing now, trying to find that delicate balance. good wheeliers make it look easy but they have a lot of skill and practiced a lot. thats the key word, practice practice practice. i think any good wheelier will tell you the same thing. some days i just go out to practice and just keep going up and down the same stretch of road until i've done several good ones in a row. then i try to concentrate on what each one of those felt like and do it the same way over and over. good luck.:rock

amen to the above post....I totally agree...take your time.. Lately (well pretty much everyday that I been riding) I just practice my 2nd gear clutch ups... I can get a front wheel up about one foot (yeah I know its not much) by using clutch on 2nd gear EVERYTIME. Which is important to me. There were couple times that it came up pretty nice and high. I was on the freeway going about 65mph. I think 2nd gear clutch ups are sooo much better. First is way to scary. I would just pop it up on first gear and as soon as it would get up I would slam it down and bike would go down really hard. Now, with 2nd gear clutch ups I can pick up the front (about 80% is really low) but at least I am trying now to get the throttle control down. Today I did couple really nice ones on the freeway ( I was in the air about 2 seconds - which sucks but its ok, its my pace.. I am not on some wheelie competition)... what I notcied is that the front comes down really nice and smooth on 2nd gear instead of 1st gear violent drop on the ground... you can pick up the front at ANY speed on 2nd gear clutchich it up.. do this: Get going on 2nd at about 45-50mph Now you have to do all this in sequence...nice and smooth: sit straight (not forward or anything - I know its hard but just keep thinking that you have to sit straight) with your index finger just pull the clutch about 1-2 inches in and in the same time (all in sequence) rev the engine to about 8 grand and in the same time let the clutch go. IT WILL COME UP... it might come up very low but at least you will get the idea and you can give more or less gas next time.. Just keep trying... I was learning 1st gear wheelies (power wheelies) and now I don't even do them because 2nd gear is SOOOO MUCH BETTER... I did mess around and poped the clutch on 1st going abotu 20 mph and the thing just got up really fast! LOL ITS ALL IN THE CLUTCH AND THROTTLE CONTROL.. what else helped me was when I saw FTP3 video. They had this one trick doing clutch up 1st gear wheelies. You can hear the engine and what it sounds like.. that really helped me... ONE FINGER ON THE CLUTCH REV THE ENGINE TO 8 GRAND AND IN THE SAME TIME RELEASE THE CLUTCH. Post here how it went ;D

Hey Alex, everyone has there fears and techniques when it comes to stunts bro. Like everyone else, i was afraid to do the stand-up deal! When you start learning them, you'll probably feel more comfortable standing up riding wheelies bc you have a bit more view and sense of balance, at least i do anyways. As far as the clutching, since im still trying to learn how to steer and lean the bike while doin the stand-up wheelies, i dont clutch. Try this, but be cautious at the same time.. while in second, get'er up to about 50-55 MPH, stand up and kinda get your feet positioned, blip the throttle real quick as if you are gonna take off and then back off, doing this quicklly, as you start to slow down rip on the throttle again and your bike should start to come up fairly easily. When your doin this, your trying to hit the power band. If it feels like it just wants to take off, try doing it again at a few more MPH. When it starts to come up in the air, dont freak out!! If you do get nervous, just let it down. Ill be the first to admit, it takes some getting used too! Just keep doing this until you start to get the feel for it. If you can stabilize the bike and your fears while its in the air, as it standing up, kinda hold your throttle slowly increasing it when you get the bike at a good angle, as if you were sitting down riding the wheelie. Its not really the rider leaning back that brings it up. Its more the fact that when your standing up, your body weight is more towards the back that allows it to come up easier. Anyhow, hopefully this will help out a little. Its the best way i know how to explain how i do it. Remember, if your going to slow(as a beginner anyways) the bike isnt gonna come up for ya. Granted, the longer you wait to bring it up (the faster your going) the less time RPM's you'll have to play with. But its how i learned. Good Luck Man, try that and post back and let me know how that works. Be Safe ~Ed P.S. If it does work for ya, head home and have a:beer and celebrate a job well done :jump

My friends and I are always helping each other out in the wheelie dept. 2 R1's and a Blackbird. @ 1st, the 2nd gear clutchups were very difficult for me, now I've found the secret recipe and it's helped out my fellow riders as well. My buddy on his R1 couldn't get it up in 2nd for the life of him, he finally figured out just how much of a difference sliding back in your seat can make! He (finally) noticed that before I brought it up, he watched me 'scoot' back in my seat. After that, he brought it up in 2nd every time, sounds weird and simple but HUGE difference. So slide back in that seat before you do anything else. Sit far enough back and you don't even need the clutch. My buddy on the Blackbird (CBR1100XX) couldn't bring it up in 2nd for shit, so he asked if he could just ride close to my right side when I would pick it up so he could see what I was doing throttle wise. I do a double pump (as I call it), I pull in the clutch rev once on the throttle and let off (very quickly) followed by a second burst of throttle and then I let out the clutch quickly but not dumping it (between 36-42mph), I don't really glance at the RPM's though I should but you need a good amount of throttle to bring it up. Now Blackbird boy is riding 2nd like there's no tomorrow<--kinda pissin me off :) Timing IS everything and if you let the clutch out to quick you'll just accelerate. So that's what works for me: 1. Scoot back (all the way if you can makes it much easier) 2. Double pump on the throttle (short burst 1st followed by lots of gas) 3. Let out the clutch and let it come up to the balance point. 4. Once you get under it hold the throttle steady (add or subtract throttle as needed once yer up) Hope this helps... helped dude on the CBR and I didn't think he could pick that heavy beast up in 2nd, but lo and behold, shit works. Nice thing bout 2nd is you get to ride it out much further than you could on a 1st gear. Giving you more time to adjust and shift (3rd) once you get up to that level (not me YET). Setting it back down is alot easier in 2nd as well, not as hard on the forks/steering stem. Hope this helps... and follow what the others are saying as far as taking it slow, just try a little further & higher each day or riding session and you should come along nicely. Everyone's got a different technique and speeds/rpm's that they're using that suits them, you'll find your own style in time. To start out, I'd say just try accelerating very hard to keep the front end up (as opposed to holding it up high on the balance point), just get a feel for riding one out for some distance, work on height later on.. Good luck & be safe, if you're getting tired/frustrated during a session just take a break or hit some twisties, otherwise you'll get frustrated and might end up doing something stupid. Last but certainly not least, find a good flat stretch of abandoned or hardly used road and ride next to someone who's really good at doing em so you can get a feel for what they're doing (throttle, clutch, body position, exhaust sound..etc.)

[QUOTE] if you're getting tired/frustrated during a session just take a break or hit some twisties, otherwise you'll get frustrated and might end up doing something stupid. after my pathetic efforts i keep resorting to this advice!

Originally posted by Alex In 2nd gear @ ~40-45 MPH (4000 to 5000 RPM maybe) I 2 finger the clutch, rev the bike to ~6500 - 7000 RPM and release the clutch (i've tried both the "dumping" and "fast progressive release" techniques). Still all I'm getting is the hard pull forward. More throttle and accelerate through. The two-finger method is good for shifting during a wheelie, but I'm not sure otherwise. Whatever is most comfortable.

Originally posted by Goose More throttle and accelerate through. The two-finger method is good for shifting during a wheelie, but I'm not sure otherwise. Whatever is most comfortable. the power is really managable, I was affraid to give it to much gas at firts to. Thats probable the most common mistake when learning wheelies is to not givei it enough gas off the start. I really does take alot to flip a bike and believe it or not there is a lot of time to react.

I have been trying second gear wheelies for awhile and havent had much success at the speeds that everybody else is posting. In the last couple of days I have been going slower than all the other post on here. I have had the best luck clutching it up going only 25 mile an hour. I realy dont know why everbody hates 1st gear wheelies. I love them, so easy to do just twist the throttle and very easy to control.

Originally posted by justrideit the power is really managable, I was affraid to give it to much gas at firts to. Thats probable the most common mistake when learning wheelies is to not givei it enough gas off the start. I really does take alot to flip a bike and believe it or not there is a lot of time to react. I hope you are talking about yourself here my friend.... takes a lot to flip ?? bullshit!! I did 12 oclock today on the parking lot going 5mph and didn't even want to do it. I ended up landing on my buddies bike which was turning to park.. long story... it is VERY easy to flip R1.. I was very close today.... I think I actually had shit in my pants ...

full on at 60-65mph in 2nd no clutch,will carry to 115mph.:confused: why yours won't wheelie in 2nd

I with you badazz. I flipped my 929 last year, and I think that sensation of flipping it again will never go away. It's always in the back of my mind, funny I don't think about my personal safety all I think about is how much that shit cost to fix. I myself have found that first gear are easier. When I clutch it up in second it just seems harder to find the balance point than in first:confused: I guess pratice makes perfect so I'll cut this short, I'm going out to pratice:D

justrideit, you need to stop smokin bro! the r1 is one of if not THE most "flippable" bikes around. hell, you can hardly keep the front tire on the ground when powering out of a corner! add 55-60 mph clutch action and there's a recipe for even pore power. this is definately one bike that requires lots of practice to master wheelieing. i'm not talking about bikes that have modified sprockets and so-on, i'm talking about stock chain and sprocket set-up. that's the way i'm trying to learn cause it takes much more skill and ultimately will make you a better wheelier if you can master stock settings.

I don't get it how wheelies just wont touch people who want to be touched. My first two wheelies were entirely unintentional. The first was crossing a hump in the road too fast , the front lifted and stayed up for a few feet. It scared the shit out of me. The second was after a moron in a car kept botherin me about a race at a light. I took off in first went to second gear and just before I was gonna go into 3rd the front wheel was up. I slammed the throttle shut and it felt like the bike was gonna spit me off. Then I had to know how. My buddy took me out and showed me. In second I whacked open the throttle to about 50mph, closed it long enough for the suspension to compress and then whacked it open. The front did'nt get very high but it was up and I was movin at a high rate of speed. I take a lot of crap from my friends for only doin power wheelies but what I really want is the all mighty freeway standup. I can't even attempt one yet.

Went riding yesterday w/ a friend on his '00 F4. My friend swore up and down that his bike was underpowered and there is no way to lift his bike up in 2nd. His bike is basically stock except for a slip on, and two teeth up from stock in the rear. He got the bigger rear sprocket to help him w/ 2nd, but for some reason he couldn't make it work. Since all I have been doing is clutching up 2nd gear on my R1, I asked him if I could take his F4 for a go. Guess what, came up very easy in 2nd. I think he just needed to see someone do it on his bike, he flagged me down, jumped on his bike, and now he's picking 'em up in 2nd no worries. The only point of this reply is that usually these things are 99% mental, up till yesterday he thought he'd need a liter bike to get 2nd gear & up. He's suddenly very happy with his 600. Just don't dump the clutch, that's the only hitch, it's timing and control, not just gassing it and popping the clutch, as stated many times, just practice. The good thing about the R1 (or at least one of 'em), is that you don't need to re-gear, it's all good out the box.

I keep learning 2nd gear clutch ups.. I carried one today on the freeway for about 6 seonds.. It was the longest and most peacefull and gentle wheelie I ever did.. DO 2nd GEEAR PEOPLE! FORGET 1st rear.. trust me.. this is comming from a guy who needed R1 to actually do a wheelie..

Originally posted by MidWest Kid Hey Alex, everyone has there fears and techniques when it comes to stunts bro. Like everyone else, i was afraid to do the stand-up deal! When you start learning them, you'll probably feel more comfortable standing up riding wheelies bc you have a bit more view and sense of balance, at least i do anyways. As far as the clutching, since im still trying to learn how to steer and lean the bike while doin the stand-up wheelies, i dont clutch. Try this, but be cautious at the same time.. while in second, get'er up to about 50-55 MPH, stand up and kinda get your feet positioned, blip the throttle real quick as if you are gonna take off and then back off, doing this quicklly, as you start to slow down rip on the throttle again and your bike should start to come up fairly easily. When your doin this, your trying to hit the power band. If it feels like it just wants to take off, try doing it again at a few more MPH. When it starts to come up in the air, dont freak out!! If you do get nervous, just let it down. Ill be the first to admit, it takes some getting used too! Just keep doing this until you start to get the feel for it. If you can stabilize the bike and your fears while its in the air, as it standing up, kinda hold your throttle slowly increasing it when you get the bike at a good angle, as if you were sitting down riding the wheelie. Its not really the rider leaning back that brings it up. Its more the fact that when your standing up, your body weight is more towards the back that allows it to come up easier. Anyhow, hopefully this will help out a little. Its the best way i know how to explain how i do it. Remember, if your going to slow(as a beginner anyways) the bike isnt gonna come up for ya. Granted, the longer you wait to bring it up (the faster your going) the less time RPM's you'll have to play with. But its how i learned. Good Luck Man, try that and post back and let me know how that works. Be Safe ~Ed P.S. If it does work for ya, head home and have a:beer and celebrate a job well done :jump Dude... thank you!!! This is what I was looking for...I want to try stand up and after reading this is lot more clear to me..

I can do the sit down, clutch-up 2nd gear wheelies but for whatever reason I can't seem to get the front up on standups, I mean, they just don't stand up very high. I've been using the 3rd gear 90mph approach and I think I probably should have started with second so this post actually and hopefully will help me out a little. I think my problem was not letting off the gas, I'd just stand up, gas it, and yank up on the bars, but the double pump thing sounds good and I'll give this a shot this week. Thanks for the tip and I'll write back if there's anything that I find that works well for me. I love this knowledge sharing shit!:thumbup

Originally posted by littlebigdenny full on at 60-65mph in 2nd no clutch,will carry to 115mph.:confused: why yours won't wheelie in 2nd Yep. I roll between 60-70 in 2nd (65 is about perfect), roll off the gas, then jump back on it hard and up she comes, The higher you get it the easier it is to keep it up there without running into redline.