Catalunya MotoGP Race

Catalunya MotoGP (http://eris.gnarf.org/~sege/Motogp_Catalunya_20040613.wmv)

Thanks alot man! Yuo are the best :D

Thanks a lot man!! I was counting on you :) since I missed this on TV :( Cheera!! /Rudra

Thanx!!!! You da Man.:thumbup I was looking for it. I missed it today. My IDOL. "THE DOCTOR" http://images.motograndprix.com/multimedia2/280/280783.jpg

Thanks........pchiava :rock :thumbup :thumbup

dude, you rock!!! Thanks!!!

Thanks pchiava. You just made my night.

Thanks for coming through for us again!

sweet!! thnx man...

Thank You:hellobye

Yes thank you very much. Don't know what this forum would do without people like you.

Thanks and damn after i looked at the spoiler.

Much obliged mate! :D :riding

:bow :bow :bow THANKS SO MUCH!!!:bow :bow :bow

Thank you very much

Man, I just watched it and Sete is such a big puss! Damn, the guy still leads the points, and still had a podium finish (and NOT third mind you), he's still got just as many fans today as he did Saturday, and he acted like such a b!tch. All upset because he didn't win. Damn, he's won two races already this year on top of everything else. IMHO he needs to learn to be more gracious.

Thanks. What another great race! Rossi's the man on two wheels.

One more thanks, your generosity is appreciated.

Geeeeeeeeezus! I knew Rossi won and I STILL giggled like a little girl in pretty pink frilly knickers watching that race. The single best racing you can watch, hands down. For respect purposes I must say though, thank Christ for Sete!!! Without whom this season would be pretty goddamn boring. If it it weren't for Vale, Sete would be as much a racing god as any other man. He is a truly extraordinary rider in his own right, he unfortunately is at the peak of his career athe same time as THE GREATEST FNUKIN RIDER THE WORLD WILL EVER SEE. Poor guy. I seriously feel for him. And you can see it in his post race interviews. He is most rightfully p!ssed off when he comes second. He knows how good he is and how unlucky he is to exist in the same era as Rossi. Like I said, poor b@stard. Still. I think we are all very lucky to witness this season. It will be a very long time before we see a level of competition the matches this. No matter what form of racing your enjoy, if you love 'racing', this is as good as it can EVER get. ( It has me fnucked teh people get a kick out of watching SWIMMING!!!!!0 Anyone agree? Respectfully.... ontiK!

All I have to say is doesn't anyone remember Doohan? Before he got out of it and Rossi came along, that guy was the sh!t and my favorite GP rider!!! Probably still is to some extent but maybe that's because I'm not totally on the Rossi bandwagon yet. Don't forget, that Doohan won five, yes 5, championships and ALL in a row mind you. Rossi is a great rider, as is Sete, but they've got a ways to go. There, now that I've stirred the pot some....

Nah, dont think you've stirred the pot at all. If you think about it, Doohan would have won a few more before his run when he had his accident. I think it would have been 7 straight Mick was a great rider. Simple.

Doohan=Racing God Rossi=Racing God of Gods:bow Doohan may have won 5 championships in a row but lets compare to Rossi. Rookie season = no championship Next four seasons = Champion Rossi will quickly destroy all of Doohans sucesses. I think Rossi might even give Hailwood a good run for his records.

to 2002 most world championships 49-02 POSITION/ RIDER/ MOTORCYCLE/ TITLES 1. Giacomo Agostini (Italy) MV Agusta/Yamaha 8 (1966-67-68-69-70-71-72-75) 2. Mick Doohan (Australia) Honda 5 (1994-95-96-97-98) 3= Eddie Lawson (U.S.) Yamaha/Honda 4 (1984-86-88-89) 3= Mike Hailwood (GB) MV Agusta 4 (1962-63-64-65) 3= John Surtees (GB) MV Agusta 4 (1956-58-59-60) 3= Geoff Duke (GB) Norton/Gilera 4 (1951-53-54-55) most championship race wins 49-02 POS RIDER MOTORCYCLE WINS 1. Giacomo Agostini (Italy) MV Agusta/Yamaha 68 (1965-76) 2. Mick Doohan (Australia) Honda 54 (1990-98) 3. Mike Hailwood (GB) Norton/MV Agusta/Honda 37 (1961-67) 4. Eddie Lawson (U.S.) Yamaha/Honda 31 (1984-92) 5. Kevin Schwantz (U.S.) Suzuki 25 (1988-94) 6= Wayne Rainey (U.S.) Yamaha 24 (1988-93) 6= Valentino Rossi (Italy) Honda 24 (2000-02) most gp wins in a season POS RIDER MOTORCYCLE WINS 1. Mick Doohan (Australia) Honda 12 (1997) 2= Giacomo Agostini (Italy) MV Agusta 11 (1972) 2= Valentino Rossi (Italy) Honda 11 (2001) 2= Valentino Rossi (Italy) Honda 11 (2002) most gp points in a season POS RIDER MOTORCYCLE POINTS 1. Valentino Rossi (Italy) Honda 355 (2002) 2. Mick Doohan (Australia) Honda 340 (1997) 3. Valentino Rossi (Italy) Honda like I said, Rossi has a ways to go and that's assuming an accident doesn't take him out of the race scene like it did Doohan.

You're dead right. Rossi still has some stats to clock up but lets look at the most telling indicator. From your own notes: POS RIDER MOTORCYCLE WINS 1. Giacomo Agostini (Italy) MV Agusta/Yamaha 68 (1965-76) 2. Mick Doohan (Australia) Honda 54 (1990-98) 3. Mike Hailwood (GB) Norton/MV Agusta/Honda 37 (1961-67) 4. Eddie Lawson (U.S.) Yamaha/Honda 31 (1984-92) 5. Kevin Schwantz (U.S.) Suzuki 25 (1988-94) 6= Wayne Rainey (U.S.) Yamaha 24 (1988-93) 6= Valentino Rossi (Italy) Honda 24 (2000-02) Its this statistic (avg wins p/yr ratio) thats the indicator for things to come: Ago 68 wins in 11 years =6.18 (3rd) Doo 54 wins in 8 years =6.75 (2nd) Hai 37 wins in 6 years =6.16 (4th) Law 31 wins in 8 years =3.87 (6th) Sch 25 wins in 4 years =6.25 (5th) Rai 24 wins in 5 years =4.8 (3rd) Ros 24 wins in 2 years =12 (1st) An average of TWELVE wins per year in just 2 years. And yes that means he has to stay on the bike and maintain his dominance. But thats the point. He IS so dominant. He is so OBVIOUSLY superior to the other riders on the track that its clear that all he has to do is stay on. And I'm Australian too for christs sake. Mighty Mick is unquestionably our finest motorsport export. I am a huge fan of Mick's and have been since well before I began riding myself. However, even when watching Vale on 125 & 250's I knew he was going to go on to write the best career on 2 wheels. Watching Rossi is Like watching Jordan play basketball. He just stands out from the pack to watch. And I think you'd find Mick would probably conceed to this too. With Mick being an aussie we used get a lot of his opinion about Vale when he was at Honda on local TV. Mick had a mentoring role and thought it was half a joke. Then there's Jerry Burgess, Vale's engineer and Mick's too as well Gardiner and others I can't remember of the top of my head. Jerry had been at honda for more that 20yrs and chose to follow Vale because he belives he is the greatest ever. Very big words.

You're right, and if you look back I did say I was a fan of Rossi's, but god forbid, he had an accident tomorrow that took him out of racing just like Doohan, then I don't believe he would be considered life's greatest two wheeled racer. My point was not only to "stir the pot", but also to put things into perspective. He [Rossi] is unquestionably a great racer, but by no means the legend people make him out to be. He's got a long way to go before becoming the Giacomo Agostini or Joey Dunlop of this era. I simply feel that it's a bit too early to say he's the greatest racer of all time, and I know that most will disagree with me, but it is just my opinion.

you still have to remember that Rossi is only 24 years old...

By all means, thats all very fair. I guess ultimately the yardstick we use to measure greatness is personally subjective. For some it will be statistics over time, for some technique and others will have their own measure or any combination of many . For me I measure the superiority/greatness of any sportsperson's by their capacity to succeed consistently regardless of circumstances. Thats why I think Schumacer while undeniably an outstanding driver makes for a pretty crappy champion. He's philosophy is win regarless of cost. He has openly admitted to 'hobbling' competition to maintain his championship and in doing so he strips himself of his own dignity and glory. Thats more a military or corporate attitude than a sporting one and really quite ugly.

Right, but if you read what I said, "You're right, and if you look back I did say I was a fan of Rossi's, but god forbid, he had an accident tomorrow that took him out of racing just like Doohan, then I don't believe he would be considered life's greatest two wheeled racer. ", then his age is of little factor. So fine, if he died tomorrow (God forbid), then put him in the books as "The Greatest Twenty Four Year Old Motorcycle Rider of All Time". To label him "THE Greatest Rider", like so many have in these forums, is diminishing the great achievments of so many other riders that have come before him. If his career ended tomorrow, I don't feel that he should be written into the books as THE greatest rider. Yes, he may have accomplished much in his 24 years, but I fail to see it as enough to justify using him as a measure for all the riders to follow him. Agostini IS that man. All are measured against him. You hear it in almost every race. A reference to Ago and that's because he set the bar, and when Rossi clears that bar then let all those that follow be measured by him, but not until.

Originally posted by ontiK For me I measure the superiority/greatness of any sportsperson's by their capacity to succeed consistently regardless of circumstances. I don't disagree, but based on this statement, then why is Joey Dunlop not THE greatest racer of all time? I dare anyone to find a moral flaw in the gentleman. As far as a racer, he was probably the most gentlemanly racer to ever grace the planet, and as for "consistency" in his 25 years of racing the TT alone, he failed to win but 8 times.

What do you think I'm gonna say? Of course that is impressive. Of course that is outstanding. Maybe you can tell me why he's not regarded as THE greatest racer of all time after making statements like? Originally posted by NoChickenStrips ...Agostini IS that man. All are measured against him... By the stats you've given I'll happily conceed that JD probably is the greatest racer if what you say is true. I can't say I have any depth of knowledge regarding his career. Maybe there are other stats that explain why he was able to be so dominant. I don't know, but on that stats alone its mind blowing. Keep in mind though that when people go looking for 'the greatest' that we have a natural tendancy to look toward the premier class in an event for the stand out champion. You could then argue 'what is the premier class?' The answer to this as subjective as any other question to the person asking it. This sort of p!ssing contest can go on as long as the participants care to waste time on it. We can all use stats to prove anything to be true and in the end nothing is resolved, because we accept as fact the stats which best fits the position we want to take. Probably best just to accept that some things (especially the more subjective ones) are just better left unresolved an move on. Right now, you're on a Yam site with Rossi at the helm presenting a very effective demonstration of a 'greatest' champion's character, granted at a very early point in his career. Given the ability (or rather lack thereof) of this forums participants to be reasonable or objective on matters subjective like this, you might make your life a little easier to be comfortable 'knowing' who the greatest racer 'really' is, and let opinions be.

You're right 100%. I won't disagree. I simply want people to think. To consider ALL of the possibilities and ALL of the other racers. NOT to diminish the achievments of so many others simply out of bias towards Rossi. Example: if I come up with the sure for cancer tomorrow, I wouldn't think it right that I be considered the greatest scientist of all time. I made a contribution to the field and however great the achievment, it shouldn't give one God Like status when so many others have discovered so many great cures for disease. Does that make sense? I guess it all boils down to how I feel that people often throw the word "hero" around and I mean that when they do it in a serious context and not jokingly about Rossi. I think it gets over used the same way that I feel "The Greatest" gets over used. You're right, it's all subjective though. I just hate to see people so narrow of focus.

thanks!...THAT WAS AN AWESOME RACE :D

Originally posted by NoChickenStrips Right, but if you read what I said, "You're right, and if you look back I did say I was a fan of Rossi's, but god forbid, he had an accident tomorrow that took him out of racing just like Doohan, then I don't believe he would be considered life's greatest two wheeled racer. ", then his age is of little factor. So fine, if he died tomorrow (God forbid), then put him in the books as "The Greatest Twenty Four Year Old Motorcycle Rider of All Time". To label him "THE Greatest Rider", like so many have in these forums, is diminishing the great achievments of so many other riders that have come before him. If his career ended tomorrow, I don't feel that he should be written into the books as THE greatest rider. Yes, he may have accomplished much in his 24 years, but I fail to see it as enough to justify using him as a measure for all the riders to follow him. Agostini IS that man. All are measured against him. You hear it in almost every race. A reference to Ago and that's because he set the bar, and when Rossi clears that bar then let all those that follow be measured by him, but not until. What I meant by "he is only 24" is that he still have lots of time to accomplish even more. He even said himself that if he could do what he is doing right now in next 2-3 years, he would be very happy and thinks he would accomplish what he wanted to accomplish.

THANKS BRO

Thx man! :thumbup :beer :beer