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Old 10-28-2012, 10:30 PM   #41
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I honestly don't kno where I was going there I think I was referring to another thread I was in and got things mixed up. No sarcasm. Carry on
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Old 10-28-2012, 10:40 PM   #42
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Lol!
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Old 10-29-2012, 12:15 AM   #43
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Who here can say vvt on a bike? I losing a cylinder and replacing it with a small vvt would ****ing rock!!! And would weight less than the current engine.
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Old 10-29-2012, 05:13 AM   #44
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I tell you though, i dont like the sound of triples, and i dont like the sound of the crossplane....i wonder if I'm going to like the sound of both combined
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Old 11-02-2012, 09:54 PM   #45
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Interesting article on the various ways that Yamaha may go about it here.

http://api.viglink.com/api/click?for...13519183484833
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Old 11-02-2012, 10:17 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ss55539 View Post
I personally would of just liked to seen a refined crossplane
you and me both man.. it almost feels like a let down...

i'm never selling my 09 to begin with but i would have hoped they
would refine it... hone down the little issues.... give us a little
something to play with...

i cant see that being much of a monster engine to be honest... but who knows.. its all hearsay and speculation i think anyway.....
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Old 11-02-2012, 10:59 PM   #47
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Actually, the current gen of R1 (09-12) is really a let down from Yamaha's history of having their super bike up near the top rather down at the bottom of the pile.

I still love the 2012 R1, but really, it is the heaviest, widest, almost the lowest rear wheel hp output among the lot in the market today.

But the cornering stability is really great and the power is very usable at the track. There ARE enhancements that can be made to bring the ponies up some 10 Hp or so at the wheels, like y-pipe, slip ons, flash tune. Still it's a heavy bike.

I personally like the direction of a triple, cos nobody has done it for the litre class. It can make the whole chassis narrower, lighter, and even if it has the same power output, it would already be huge improvement and also very usable power.

And it's even more interesting cos nobody knows how they gonna do it, which is something I would like if Yamaha came up with something ingenious and out of the box.

Will only be able to tell when they announce it next year. Talk is Yamaha will be back at WSB in 2014, which is kinda in line with the development of a brand new R1 / R6 seeing how the updates have been minimal to both models over the years. It's time for a new R1 revloution.

Not dissing anyone, not supporting anyone. Just giving my opinion on the whole crossplane triple idea. In short, I'm excited to see what it is all about.


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Old 11-03-2012, 12:09 PM   #48
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The problem with the cross-plan design - in any implementation - is that it is heavier than "conventional" approach (ie. 180-deg in I4 config., or 120-deg in a triple). With the advent of ABS & electronic traction control, there is no practical need for all this emphasis on "feel" using mechanical-oriented approaches that inherently add more weight into the system compared to lighter electronic & software-based solutions.

A 180-deg I4 or 120-deg 1100cc triple with traction control & ABS will always be a lighter than any cross-plane approach. I think the marketing dept. is influencing engineering dept. too much. They need to remember how important mass control is. They've really "gone off into the weeds" so to speak as far as the design basics are concerned in this regard. 445# compared to the near-400# competition is just flat out embarrassing.
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Old 11-03-2012, 12:39 PM   #49
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Marketing? The engine is outstanding. The crossplane engine has won the last 3 AMA championships. In GP that engine has won 6 premier class titles. It won the WSBK title too.

I can understand knocking it for a track bike if you are racing for dollars in WERA or CMRA but if you aren't racing for money then it's a dumb argument. As a trackday bike it's outstanding and also makes a great road bike. Not everybody is so focused on bullshit bragging rights. I'll take this engine or a v4 over a traditional inline motor with +10, 20, or 30 HP any day of the week. Great thing about the staggered crank or a v4 is that TC becomes mostly unnecessary due to firing order.
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Old 11-03-2012, 01:30 PM   #50
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i wonder what they would do on the drag strip....
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How do you know the tooth brush was invented in Kentucky? If it were developed anywhere else it would be called a teeth brush.

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Kentucky: 5 million people, 10 last names.

Why couldn't the baby Jesus be born in Kentucky? Because they couldn't find 3 wise men or a virgin.

Why are there so many unsolved murders in Kentucky? There are no dental records and everyone has the same DNA
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Old 11-03-2012, 03:30 PM   #51
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You would
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Old 11-03-2012, 03:45 PM   #52
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You would
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Old 11-03-2012, 07:04 PM   #53
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You would
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How do you know the tooth brush was invented in Kentucky? If it were developed anywhere else it would be called a teeth brush.

What do you call a female virgin in Kentucky? Faster than her brothers.

Kentucky: 5 million people, 10 last names.

Why couldn't the baby Jesus be born in Kentucky? Because they couldn't find 3 wise men or a virgin.

Why are there so many unsolved murders in Kentucky? There are no dental records and everyone has the same DNA
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Old 11-04-2012, 03:34 AM   #54
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Quote:
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Marketing? The engine is outstanding. The crossplane engine has won the last 3 AMA championships. In GP that engine has won 6 premier class titles. It won the WSBK title too.

I can understand knocking it for a track bike if you are racing for dollars in WERA or CMRA but if you aren't racing for money then it's a dumb argument. As a trackday bike it's outstanding and also makes a great road bike. Not everybody is so focused on bullshit bragging rights. I'll take this engine or a v4 over a traditional inline motor with +10, 20, or 30 HP any day of the week...
I didn't argue in favor of peak HP, so pipe down & drop that red-herring argument. Weight & size are legitimate factors. The bike is big & heavy. Significantly heavier than the competing brands. There's simply no denying this. Call it bullshit if you like, but I'm not interested in throwing money down for regression on these 2 points. I want a small, light liter-class bike, which Yamaha currently no longer produces. It's certainly the factory's choice to go in that direction, but the current design brief doesn't get my vote in totality. They hit a few things, but missed the mark in the totality.

The avg. factory-level superbike has roughly $150K invested into it, & probably even more. For a current-gen platform going on 4+ yrs now, & with the kind of money that factory teams invest to develop a platform, I would expect some wins by now. Regardless, that isn't the issue. What happens in SBK is largely irrelevant to the Joe buying a bike off the showroom floor. I don't have $150K to invest in a bike just to bring it up to snuff with the competition, & yet if I did, I still wouldn't spend it for that purpose. I want it to be a stock front runner from the factory.

I have zero interest in a 445# sportbike, sport. If you like that, then by all means, throw down, be happy, & good on ya'. My expectations of a sportbike includes compact dimensions, light weight, responsive handling, tech (eg. ABS, traction control), & a usable power band. This model has only hit a couple of those factors with the current offering. For $15+K asking price, I expect more. My opinion, my money.

Quote:
Great thing about the staggered crank or a v4 is that TC becomes mostly unnecessary due to firing order.
And yet they felt it necessary to incorporate ETC in the current release. Guess it didn't quite work out as planned.

Last edited by WheelSpin; 11-04-2012 at 03:42 AM.
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Old 03-12-2013, 02:12 AM   #55
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Yamaha becomes a joke. The concentration of stupidity is incredible.

This is that I think Yamaha needs:

1. Get back to conventional 4 cylinder design and find the company which can build proper 4cylinder engine for them.
2. Make sure the engine manufacturer is actually mapping the ECU correctly and optimally. Fueling, ycc-t and ignition on 2007 to 2012 R1 is a fricking shit joke (looking at it via flash-tune).
3. Fix the suspension - linear springs please! Stop the progressive madness.
4. ABS please!
5. Finally remove the under tail exhausts! This is just stupid design for "Kids". It does not make sense in any engineering sense.
6. Get rid of all current designers and current marketing idiots you have. Hire some bright engineers and riders. Let them build a great motorcycle.
7. What we (customers) want:

4 cylinder normal plane engine. No stupid experiments or marketing tricks.
200+ HP on the crank, 185+ HP at the rear wheel for both US and EU models.
20L fuel tank.
ABS, DTC.
Linear springs. Quality suspension.
Normal single low mounted exhaust.
Quality light wheel rims.
195KG wet maximum.
$14,000 maximum.
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Old 03-12-2013, 03:11 AM   #56
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Why is there a need for a 200hp street bike? I don't get it.
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Old 03-12-2013, 04:38 AM   #57
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Why is there a need for a 200hp street bike? I don't get it.

Same reason why big tits are cool, you could argue they are a waste but doesn't stop you trying to get the whole thing in one hand.
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Old 03-12-2013, 05:21 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elwin View Post
Yamaha becomes a joke. The concentration of stupidity is incredible.

This is that I think Yamaha needs:

1. Get back to conventional 4 cylinder design and find the company which can build proper 4cylinder engine for them.
2. Make sure the engine manufacturer is actually mapping the ECU correctly and optimally. Fueling, ycc-t and ignition on 2007 to 2012 R1 is a fricking shit joke (looking at it via flash-tune).
3. Fix the suspension - linear springs please! Stop the progressive madness.
4. ABS please!
5. Finally remove the under tail exhausts! This is just stupid design for "Kids". It does not make sense in any engineering sense.
6. Get rid of all current designers and current marketing idiots you have. Hire some bright engineers and riders. Let them build a great motorcycle.
7. What we (customers) want:

4 cylinder normal plane engine. No stupid experiments or marketing tricks.
200+ HP on the crank, 185+ HP at the rear wheel for both US and EU models.
20L fuel tank.
ABS, DTC.
Linear springs. Quality suspension.
Normal single low mounted exhaust.
Quality light wheel rims.
195KG wet maximum.
$14,000 maximum.
1. We dont know how it will act, so until then, we cant say anything
2. Mapping has been an issue for a while, they should had it fixed by now, i agree
3. They sell it as a street bike, if youre racing, youre going to replace it anyway at some point
4. Really? Learn how to ride, no need for ABS
5. Thats personal. I personally love the undertail exhaust
6. If you ask me, Yamaha has been the best motorcycle to buy right out of the crate, but again thats personal.
7. Ok, this is a series of stupidity, but let me try:

Weve been through the 4cyl thing
200hp is not necessary, remember, the tires are only so big, bike already runs high 9s in the 1/4 mile stock the way it is, you dont need more power, like i said, learn how to use the power you have
I dont use the sport bike for long trips, so as long as i can finish a race with the tank I'm good
Weve been through the exhaust and suspension already

Ok the last 3 is going to be a package answer.
Quality wheels, less weight, and max of $14k. You want a blowjob with it too?


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Old 03-12-2013, 05:25 AM   #59
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They down tune the bike in the US due to EPA regulations, starting in 2007...

And I totally agree with Marcelo
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Old 03-12-2013, 05:42 AM   #60
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Originally Posted by MaRce1o View Post
1. We dont know how it will act, so until then, we cant say anything
2. Mapping has been an issue for a while, they should had it fixed by now, i agree
3. They sell it as a street bike, if youre racing, youre going to replace it anyway at some point
4. Really? Learn how to ride, no need for ABS
5. Thats personal. I personally love the undertail exhaust
6. If you ask me, Yamaha has been the best motorcycle to buy right out of the crate, but again thats personal.
7. Ok, this is a series of stupidity, but let me try:

Weve been through the 4cyl thing
200hp is not necessary, remember, the tires are only so big, bike already runs high 9s in the 1/4 mile stock the way it is, you dont need more power, like i said, learn how to use the power you have
I dont use the sport bike for long trips, so as long as i can finish a race with the tank I'm good
Weve been through the exhaust and suspension already

Ok the last 3 is going to be a package answer.
Quality wheels, less weight, and max of $14k. You want a blowjob with it too?


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