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Old 11-28-2012, 12:03 PM   #1
MMMichael
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Beginner suspension items

So I've decided to make my 05 R1 my track bike. The bike is totally stock and has had the snot ran out of it, so needless to say, it NEEDS some freshening up. I will start by saying I don't want to have to sell body parts to be able to buy these suspension components...I know ohlins is great. However it isn't in the cards, nor do I think it should be for someone who hasn't set foot on a track before.

What I was thinking was a budget friendly (I understand most is expensive, like 800 bucks fork and 800 bucks rear shock.) suspension set up for my weight. I would get out on the track and figure out what I need but I don't want anything to make me more nervous or jittery than I already will be. I want to be able to know my suspension is good, for the most part, and be able to fine tune it.

I'm looking for Front forks. I'm assuming what I need is a cartridge kit?? Idk though. What are you guys using?

As far as rear shock, I've been looking at penske but I don't really know what I'm looking at. What do I need?

I weigh about 175 lbs before gear. Idk if that helps some of you guys or not but just thought I'd lay it all out there. I'm 6'4" also.

I like Racetech stuff because it seems to be budget friendly. I will probably buy the components and have a local in IN install them, and set them up for me. 35motorsports.. Idk if anyone has heard of them or not.

Thanks! sorry if this is all over the place, trying to learn and get setup but I'm already nervous. haha!

-Michael
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Old 11-28-2012, 01:01 PM   #2
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i dont know the answers to all you questions but heres the info i do know.

you want to do fork internals to save the money and to my knowledge you could send the stock shock out to be redone for you. so really your just looking at upgrading your own forks/shock is the first step in suspention tuning.

i wish i knew more but honestly i havent looked much into this area yet. still learning just like you.
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Old 11-28-2012, 02:26 PM   #3
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What all do you mean by fork internals? What all is included and will need upgrading? Also, If I were to buy "cartridges" for my forks, does that include everything for the fork internals?

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Old 11-28-2012, 02:52 PM   #4
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Okay, using the search is your friend:

http://www.r1-forum.com/forums/search.php


With that, do a search for "Suspension", which will give you all the threads containing "Suspension". The one you are looking for is called "Suspension Setup 101" by DanQ:

http://www.r1-forum.com/forums/showt...sion+setup+101


Honestly, I can't tell you how much knowledge and information you'll gain from reading that thread alone.
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Old 11-28-2012, 02:53 PM   #5
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Cartridges will replace the full internals of your forks. They are highly rebuildable (important for race folks), highly customizable (important for race folks) and priced lower than full forks.

Most people can get buy with new pistons (valves, also known as a piston kit) and springs that are proper for weight. They cost much less than cartridge kits.
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:00 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fjorn View Post
Okay, using the search is your friend:

http://www.r1-forum.com/forums/search.php


With that, do a search for "Suspension", which will give you all the threads containing "Suspension". The one you are looking for is called "Suspension Setup 101" by DanQ:

http://www.r1-forum.com/forums/showt...sion+setup+101


Honestly, I can't tell you how much knowledge and information you'll gain from reading that thread alone.
I actually have that saved as a link on my desktop to read tonight before I go to bed..lol Thanks!
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:02 PM   #7
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Cartridges will replace the full internals of your forks. They are highly rebuildable (important for race folks), highly customizable (important for race folks) and priced lower than full forks.

Most people can get buy with new pistons (valves, also known as a piston kit) and springs that are proper for weight. They cost much less than cartridge kits.
Ahh... So would it be better to buy the piston kit or to just swap out the entire cartridge? Piece of mind plays a huge role for me, but budget is also a concern. I will look these items up tonight, along with reading your suspension "Bible". Thanks!
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:04 PM   #8
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You can do an Ohlins respring, piston kit and service for 450-550$ installed. The Ohlins cartridge kit is superior, but possibly more than you'd need and 1300-1500 installed. There are other companies out there, but most would suggest Ohlins.
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:09 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by MMMichael View Post
Ahh... So would it be better to buy the piston kit or to just swap out the entire cartridge? Piece of mind plays a huge role for me, but budget is also a concern. I will look these items up tonight, along with reading your suspension "Bible". Thanks!
Honestly, read the first 8 posts of the thread, follow the steps, and see what the forks are not doing adequately for you. Then determine the extent of your mods. A properly set suspension is more than a collection of high dollar parts. Even the gold stuff needs to be set to you and tuned for your style. Once you figure out what the stock forks can not do for you, you'll have a much better idea of what to do.

I'm not against buying stuff, but know what you need first. You don't even have to read the whole thread: Set sag and damping, and see what the bike can't do. It can literally be the difference of thousands of dollars spent.
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:12 PM   #10
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It can literally be the difference of thousands of dollars spent.
But, but... What about all those people with money burning a hole in their pocket?



I still need to get the R1's suspension redone. But, have other priorities. I will need to find a new corner since #13 at Jennings is no longer an option at this point in time.
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:18 PM   #11
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Because you are a beginner moving into a racing suspension is a waste of money. The R1 stock suspensions are far better than your skills, it can match up to high pace racing intermedium level. And you are also in their stock weight springs range. Just replace the oil for a fresh one if you haven’t since brand new (it degradates after 3k), and get some assistance for damping tuning (sag, compresion, rebound).

Put a race body on it (you will save money in case you crash), steel brake lines, 520 gearing and you are ready to go for having a lot of fun.

If you still have some money, invest it on professional training, you will enjoy your bike so much then… do not waste your money on racing components you will not even appreciate any difference, trust me. Just my 2 cents.

Last edited by mmerelles; 11-28-2012 at 03:30 PM.
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:19 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanQ View Post
Honestly, read the first 8 posts of the thread, follow the steps, and see what the forks are not doing adequately for you. Then determine the extent of your mods. A properly set suspension is more than a collection of high dollar parts. Even the gold stuff needs to be set to you and tuned for your style. Once you figure out what the stock forks can not do for you, you'll have a much better idea of what to do.

I'm not against buying stuff, but know what you need first. You don't even have to read the whole thread: Set sag and damping, and see what the bike can't do. It can literally be the difference of thousands of dollars spent.
That's the best thing that could have been said, very well put Dan!
Nothing left for us to add, we can close this thread now.
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:33 PM   #13
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But, but... What about all those people with money burning a hole in their pocket?
I take donations. My limp has become much more stylish, and I often improvise with a cane

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Originally Posted by fjorn View Post
I still need to get the R1's suspension redone. But, have other priorities. I will need to find a new corner since #13 at Jennings is no longer an option at this point in time.
If you're just talking a refresh, remind me before the Memorial and I can do it track side as long as we have enough people to do tech inspections.

As far as turns, CMP has some fun ones for you, and you'll be able to use the power of the R1 in a few places. Just don't try it in 14

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That's the best thing that could have been said, very well put Dan!
Nothing left for us to add, we can close this thread now.
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Old 11-28-2012, 04:44 PM   #14
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All of the information so far has been great!

DanQ- That write up is excellent and in-depth enough for my stupid self, however I may just send you a PM if I get stuck while setting up my suspension.

My problem is, How much trust can be put into 7 year old suspension, that I know without a doubt hasn't been touched? I'm a huge "while I'm in there" kind of guy and don't really want to have to do things two or three times when it could've been done once and forgotten about. I DO NOT have money just burning a hole in my pocket, if there's a dollar to be saved, I'll be the one saving it. HOWEVER, the race track (from what I've read) isn't the place to skimp. I'd hate to have something go wrong, big or small, because I should have done this first or should have bought this. Whether or not that's inevitable is for the future to say....

I really thought I could save a headache in the future here while it's winter in Indiana and upgrade my parts now whenever the funds are available. For roughly 500-600 bucks front and rear for slight-moderate upgrades why wouldn't you? Especially for something that won't need to be upgraded for a long time if ever.

Just my opinion though. I know everyone else will have one, so let me hear it. Gonna work on DanQ's write up tomorrow and hopefully get things figured out a little bit.
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Old 11-28-2012, 05:11 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by MMMichael View Post
All of the information so far has been great!

DanQ- That write up is excellent and in-depth enough for my stupid self, however I may just send you a PM if I get stuck while setting up my suspension.

My problem is, How much trust can be put into 7 year old suspension, that I know without a doubt hasn't been touched? I'm a huge "while I'm in there" kind of guy and don't really want to have to do things two or three times when it could've been done once and forgotten about. I DO NOT have money just burning a hole in my pocket, if there's a dollar to be saved, I'll be the one saving it. HOWEVER, the race track (from what I've read) isn't the place to skimp. I'd hate to have something go wrong, big or small, because I should have done this first or should have bought this. Whether or not that's inevitable is for the future to say....

I really thought I could save a headache in the future here while it's winter in Indiana and upgrade my parts now whenever the funds are available. For roughly 500-600 bucks front and rear for slight-moderate upgrades why wouldn't you? Especially for something that won't need to be upgraded for a long time if ever.

Just my opinion though. I know everyone else will have one, so let me hear it. Gonna work on DanQ's write up tomorrow and hopefully get things figured out a little bit.
Are you the guy in Greenwood, IN?
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Old 11-28-2012, 05:22 PM   #16
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Are you the guy in Greenwood, IN?
IDK what you mean by that, lol but yeah I'm from Greenwood, IN
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Old 11-28-2012, 05:25 PM   #17
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IDK what you mean by that, lol but yeah I'm from Greenwood, IN
Chris was telling me about you. I can get with you and walk you through it. Take a look at the suspension and make a few suggestions. If the numbers line up, just send the units out for service and be ready for next year. I live over by 65 and Main.
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Old 11-28-2012, 05:31 PM   #18
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Chris was telling me about you. I can get with you and walk you through it. Take a look at the suspension and make a few suggestions. If the numbers line up, just send the units out for service and be ready for next year. I live over by 65 and Main.
Yeah, I've been buggin the crap out of him. My bad.. lol I'm gonna hopefully get some time to get out tomorrow and mess with it a little bit. It's all kinda foreign to me but I think once I get out there I'll be fine.

Thanks for the offer bud, and I'll take you up on it if you're for real. You live like 20 min from me. Im right at 144 and 37.
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Old 11-28-2012, 06:03 PM   #19
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Yeah, I've been buggin the crap out of him. My bad.. lol I'm gonna hopefully get some time to get out tomorrow and mess with it a little bit. It's all kinda foreign to me but I think once I get out there I'll be fine.

Thanks for the offer bud, and I'll take you up on it if you're for real. You live like 20 min from me. Im right at 144 and 37.
We're for real. Pretty tight squad around here.
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Old 11-28-2012, 06:09 PM   #20
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Yeah, I've been buggin the crap out of him. My bad.. lol I'm gonna hopefully get some time to get out tomorrow and mess with it a little bit. It's all kinda foreign to me but I think once I get out there I'll be fine.

Thanks for the offer bud, and I'll take you up on it if you're for real. You live like 20 min from me. Im right at 144 and 37.
He's the real deal...depending on what you end up needing. I'd send the stuff to Reuben in Moorseville for a simple refresh, or send the stuff to DanQ for a rebuild.

Meister is a good dude...he was just up here helping me out with a few things. We give each other a lot of shit around here, but if you need something, you aren't going to get a much better group of guys
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