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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
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hard to say, a short in the system for the starter could cause your problem. and still not sure where that harness in your picture goes to, cause that looks like one of the pins got burned up or broken in that picture. the 3rd pin on the top is the one im talking about
after looking in to this burnt out pin on the unknown relay…. I found out it is number 26 on the wiring diagram….Exup Servo. Looks like a delete of some sort, I do t have the normalexpo servo it’s a complete after market exhaust and doesn’t have one. This looks just like the one in the picture..this wouldn’t be a factor in my bike starting or not? Just the code popping up right?
 

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If there is someway of dropping the tang in the pins of both wires in each connector, just use a male/female end and run that one wire (connection) outside the connectors. Solder more wire if it needs to extend the job. Address that first. Clear codes and see who pops up next? But I think you might have just that as one problem and one problem only... is the guess of the phantom codes setting off. Usually it is one thing, meaning. Might be the no start problem.

Also, where is the voltage read on the battery, if not charge it while the repair is being done. Want to see a load test on the battery than bring it to an auto store; with a volt meter set at 20v, clip the probes to the battery:

12.8v say is a fully charged battery and you now start the bike up.
5.5v says it went down that much and you heard it tap at the relay.
11.1v - back to 12.8v and lights right up idling.

You just read the difference between a good pusher (volts) and no push to turn over the starter. Change battery if under 10v load.
 

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after looking in to this burnt out pin on the unknown relay…. I found out it is number 26 on the wiring diagram….Exup Servo. Looks like a delete of some sort, I do t have the normalexpo servo it’s a complete after market exhaust and doesn’t have one. This looks just like the one in the picture..this wouldn’t be a factor in my bike starting or not? Just the code popping up right?
Exup problems shouldn't cause the bike to not start. My 05 has an Exup code that pops up now and then, I assume its just something going bad, either my delete or part of the wiring. But mine starts and runs just fine when the light is on. So your main problem is something else. As you should be able to unplug the Exup system and still start and run, you just get codes for it.
 

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Now a no servo in play comes in?... "I do t have the normalexpo servo it’s a complete after market exhaust and doesn’t have one." Are there any more mods done to the bike? A PC installed? I agree with Shotgun if a servo was there. So it can't be the servo if not in the pipe? Is that our understanding?

No spark, right?

#13 ~ Follow this connector down to the wire harness. Disconnect at that junction point. With ohmmeter set to 20v, crank the engine over and see if the one wire [pick any of the 4] different color wires and wait for it to come around and show power/a spike at the meter. The others of the same color is ground. So you want to make sure you set the meter to ohms or infinity and touch one of those grounds to the ground side of the main harness and is there ground showing at the meter? It's as if you touch both probes together showing a complete loop... to ground. So ground is out of the way, did you see current to one of the sparkstick wires?
 

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Discussion Starter · #25 ·
Now a no servo in play comes in?... "I do t have the normalexpo servo it’s a complete after market exhaust and doesn’t have one." Are there any more mods done to the bike? A PC installed? I agree with Shotgun if a servo was there. So it can't be the servo if not in the pipe? Is that our understanding?

No spark, right?

#13 ~ Follow this connector down to the wire harness. Disconnect at that junction point. With ohmmeter set to 20v, crank the engine over and see if the one wire [pick any of the 4] different color wires and wait for it to come around and show power/a spike at the meter. The others of the same color is ground. So you want to make sure you set the meter to ohms or infinity and touch one of those grounds to the ground side of the main harness and is there ground showing at the meter? It's as if you touch both probes together showing a complete loop... to ground. So ground is out of the way, did you see current to one of the sparkstick wires?
No spark and that is correct complete yoshi exhaust… also i just replaced the starter today and I am still not getting the bike to even turn over… I just did some further searching and there is no kickstand switch would that be the reason for the bike not even turning?? Attached is a picture
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
Now a no servo in play comes in?... "I do t have the normalexpo servo it’s a complete after market exhaust and doesn’t have one." Are there any more mods done to the bike? A PC installed? I agree with Shotgun if a servo was there. So it can't be the servo if not in the pipe? Is that our understanding?

No spark, right?

#13 ~ Follow this connector down to the wire harness. Disconnect at that junction point. With ohmmeter set to 20v, crank the engine over and see if the one wire [pick any of the 4] different color wires and wait for it to come around and show power/a spike at the meter. The others of the same color is ground. So you want to make sure you set the meter to ohms or infinity and touch one of those grounds to the ground side of the main harness and is there ground showing at the meter? It's as if you touch both probes together showing a complete loop... to ground. So ground is out of the way, did you see current to one of the sparkstick wires?
This is where it led me… do I check one of these openings?
 

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Let's try this... put it in top gear. You are not going to pull the plugs and make it easier, but this is more a fast...'is the engine stuck by sitting and rust set in to lock the crank from moving.' That's first.

Second is get an ohmmeter and check the battery voltage. Volts means 'push' and if the battery has no push, then it's the battery and not a stuck engine if said engine is not stuck in other words.

Third is the safety side stand switch looks hooked up. Up or down in N it will start. Say it was disconnected. Then I believe when you place it in gear it will kill the engine. Kill switch to on, correct?
 

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Discussion Starter · #28 ·
Let's try this... put it in top gear. You are not going to pull the plugs and make it easier, but this is more a fast...'is the engine stuck by sitting and rust set in to lock the crank from moving.' That's first.

Second is get an ohmmeter and check the battery voltage. Volts means 'push' and if the battery has no push, then it's the battery and not a stuck engine if said engine is not stuck in other words.

Third is the safety side stand switch looks hooked up. Up or down in N it will start. Say it was disconnected. Then I believe when you place it in gear it will kill the engine. Kill switch to on, correct?
When I put it into gear it doesn’t even click..like it locks up…how do I check to see if the engine is stuck?? The battery is my second one the first one was too old and done, i even have it hooked up to the trickle charger now cause I know I keep draining it trying different things out but this one I just got from the chaparral. Yes I make sure the kill switch is in the right position.
 

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This is where it led me… do I check one of these openings?
Yes.
Note the spark-stick harness and 4 of the same color wires is ground. So on the main harness side, look for that color ground wire and see if ground has integrity from that harness to a ground on the frame. In other words, all grounds from the harness eventually connect to one big eyelet and that is bolted to ground on the frame. So once you see that ground from the eyelet is not broken off, it says the grounds for the sticks are good.

Next, I'd try to see if I can make spark by removing the crank cover side, and there is a tone wheel with 4 bumps or more? Then there is the crank pickup that the wheels sweeps past. That tone wheel might have a 1-4 mark or a 2-3 mark on the wheel? Set the line of either one next to the pickup.

Say 1-4 is the closest to the pickup. You now find on the spark harness either 1 or 4 color, install that (+) probe in that color wire on the main harness side of 1 or 4, then with key on, take a flat blade screwdriver and toggle back and forth between the tone tooth and the pickup to make the 1 or 4 wire show current to that wire.

You just cycled the whole spark system, meaning, the coil works, the wires are all plugged in up to the main harness end, the pickup works to spark, and the ECU is part of that flow and says all you need now is to turn the engine over to make the same spark when all is hooked back up.
 

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When I put it into gear it doesn’t even click..like it locks up…how do I check to see if the engine is stuck??

Remove part 28 to turn the crank another way. Look for those marks. Unless you have access to a manual, I have you removing the cover and 28 is not big enough to touch tone wheel to pickup.


3 is the tone wheel with the teeth. 23 is the pickup and here is where you want to move the 1-4 tooth to the mark on the case, then the tooth will line up with 23 and you toggle that with all wires hooked up, but the spark stick harness. Then toggle the pickup with key on, and this stops the engine from turning and you getting the driver caught and bust the sensor, bend the tone wheel, etc.

Even a test light with the icepick tip and the light in the handle. That shows the toggling a lot better.


The battery is my second one the first one was too old and done, i even have it hooked up to the trickle charger now cause I know I keep draining it trying different things out but this one I just got from the chaparral. Yes I make sure the kill switch is in the right position.
With 28 removed, you are going to tell right off it the crank is seized or can't move due to rust/condensation via sitting.
 

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Discussion Starter · #31 ·
Yes.
Note the spark-stick harness and 4 of the same color wires is ground. So on the main harness side, look for that color ground wire and see if ground has integrity from that harness to a ground on the frame. In other words, all grounds from the harness eventually connect to one big eyelet and that is bolted to ground on the frame. So once you see that ground from the eyelet is not broken off, it says the grounds for the sticks are good.

Next, I'd try to see if I can make spark by removing the crank cover side, and there is a tone wheel with 4 bumps or more? Then there is the crank pickup that the wheels sweeps past. That tone wheel might have a 1-4 mark or a 2-3 mark on the wheel? Set the line of either one next to the pickup.

Say 1-4 is the closest to the pickup. You now find on the spark harness either 1 or 4 color, install that (+) probe in that color wire on the main harness side of 1 or 4, then with key on, take a flat blade screwdriver and toggle back and forth between the tone tooth and the pickup to make the 1 or 4 wire show current to that wire.

You just cycled the whole spark system, meaning, the coil works, the wires are all plugged in up to the main harness end, the pickup works to spark, and the ECU is part of that flow and says all you need now is to turn the engine over to make the same spark when all is hooked back up.
The one I pulled is the wiring harness that’s on the power commander...do I still test it that way?
 

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Remove the PC. Right now you want the OEM wired up and no accessories. Remove is no ground hooked up, no power to the PC. But then it won't loop thru the OEM so off it comes for now.
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
Remove the PC. Right now you want the OEM wired up and no accessories. Remove is no ground hooked up, no power to the PC. But then it won't loop thru the OEM so off it comes for now.
Ok I will remove the PC and the power going to it for now… anyone can find any video testing the harness.. I hate electrical but I have to learn. So I will be testing one prong from my tester to the main harness and then the black one to the ground on the female side?
 

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Think of a simple lamp. Two prongs at one end of the wire, then one wire at the bulb and the other wire for ground at the side of the brass screw bulb holder.

So you are setting the one probe to the prong of one wire end, then touch the brass bulb holder and you know that wire end is hooked to the bulb side. Then the other prong at the other wire end is the one end again, and now this wire lands on the bulb's soldered center of the bulb.

Once you know from one pin to the other end of the wire has no breaks at those wires... from end to end, and now since those are good, has to be a broken filament in the bulb. Kind of look at a wire like that.

But then again, look at what we are doing. I am running you around so you can get a grasp of how many moves you can make figuring out that one wire drop.

You can move the crank 2 ways. One is with the back wheel, the other is at the 28 service cap and turn the crank that way.

You can test for spark two ways. I have you checking ground integrity and toggling the whole spark system with a screwdriver. Either way, you can physically inspect each connection point, or put it all together, remove all the clips off the spark-sticks, pull one stick out and plug it back into say 1 or 4. Why? Because you set the 1-4 at the mark and if you can get a pocket screwdriver down at the 23 pickup and tap wheel 3, you can see the spark [old plug in the stick] that way as well.

Walk away from it and think about it. Get a fresh start at it once back at it.
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PC wiring:
Watch how you have to yank it off, not remove either hot or ground. Why? Because if the hot is to the injector, it's going to hot the PC. If the clip is still on the OEM injector, this too is a ground if you keep the clips on and the PC's main +/- off. Make sense?
 

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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
Think of a simple lamp. Two prongs at one end of the wire, then one wire at the bulb and the other wire for ground at the side of the brass screw bulb holder.

So you are setting the one probe to the prong of one wire end, then touch the brass bulb holder and you know that wire end is hooked to the bulb side. Then the other prong at the other wire end is the one end again, and now this wire lands on the bulb's soldered center of the bulb.

Once you know from one pin to the other end of the wire has no breaks at those wires... from end to end, and now since those are good, has to be a broken filament in the bulb. Kind of look at a wire like that.

But then again, look at what we are doing. I am running you around so you can get a grasp of how many moves you can make figuring out that one wire drop.

You can move the crank 2 ways. One is with the back wheel, the other is at the 28 service cap and turn the crank that way.

You can test for spark two ways. I have you checking ground integrity and toggling the whole spark system with a screwdriver. Either way, you can physically inspect each connection point, or put it all together, remove all the clips off the spark-sticks, pull one stick out and plug it back into say 1 or 4. Why? Because you set the 1-4 at the mark and if you can get a pocket screwdriver down at the 23 pickup and tap wheel 3, you can see the spark [old plug in the stick] that way as well.

Walk away from it and think about it. Get a fresh start at it once back at it.
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PC wiring:
Watch how you have to yank it off, not remove either hot or ground. Why? Because if the hot is to the injector, it's going to hot the PC. If the clip is still on the OEM injector, this too is a ground if you keep the clips on and the PC's main +/- off. Make sense?
Ehhh I understand what your saying I will try out all you said tomorrow and if I have any issues I’ll post a pic or link to a video thanks for all your help…#letsgetthisbikestarted
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
Ehhh I understand what your saying I will try out all you said tomorrow and if I have any issues I’ll post a pic or link to a video thanks for all your help…#letsgetthisbikestarted
Weird request…is anyone willing to FaceTime or video call me to take a look at this issue and assist with the diagnosis? Sorry I feel so dumb when it comes to electrical issues
 

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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
Weird request…is anyone willing to FaceTime or video call me to take a look at this issue and assist with the diagnosis? Sorry I feel so dumb when it comes to electrical issues
Also good new guys it doesn’t look rusted up and corroded I attached pictures
 

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Is the kickstand switch jumped?

Let's see if I understand the problem correctly, when in gear with the clutch pulled and the kickstand down or up, the starter relay doesn't click, with it in neutral and the rest the same, it still doesn't click.

If yes, then does the neutral light show up on the gauges?

You may have a bad fuel cut relay. If I read the wiring diagram the fuel cut relay coil is routed through the relays and ground for the starter goes through the normally open side of the fuel cut relay. Might be hot, I'd have to look at the diagram again, it's been a minute.

There is a test procedure for the fuel cut relay outlined in the service manual available for download and review here on the forum in the mechanical help section under the 2004-2006 tab.

Download the manual and start testing the components. It may sound silly, but also check your clutch switch bud, I've seen folks bang there head against the wall searching for a no start solution only to find the clutch switch disconnect or broken.
 

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Discussion Starter · #40 ·
Looks clean and undamaged unless you hear something and went there for some reason? I'm getting stumped about removing engine parts for a no start? Where are we at?
I removed the 28 like you said previously…once I did that there was no where for me to try to crank it over at so I removed the entire thing to take a look at the stator and make sure it wasn’t rusted inside to make sure it wasn’t stuck.

i tried to follow the direction of testing the harness but I was still a bit confused as to how to test each individual one. I did however test eachspark plug housing and it was within spec.
Also probably worth noting…when I go to try to start it in the morning I hear a very very brief attempt to start and after that just clicking and the fuel pump priming.
 
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