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2015 R1, 2008 R6
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445 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Well,
I have made it well known that I am struggling with the suspension setup on the new R1. I have no front end feel, and the ride height is extremely high.

I have been to one trackside tuner to get the initial sag and setting into the bike. Still not happy with the results.

I received phone support from another race team that gave me some baseline settings and that improved the bike but the stock valving and spring rate for me just needed to be updated.

I am 5'9" and weigh 195ish without gear. I ended up going to Dan Kyle Racing and ordered Ohlins 30mm NIX cartridges, and a TTX GP rear shock (Came in the mail today:boobies )

I usually like my bike a little under-sprung when using Ohlins on my previous R1's at .90.

The stock R1 comes with .90 spring rates and it is waay too soft for me.

Dan Kyle explained that this R1 is setup so differently than previous years that you cannot use those old values due to the weight distribution difference on the new model.

He talked me into 10.5 spring rate for the bike which is super scary as that seems way too stiff. I trusted him as I think most would agree that he is one of the most reputable suspension guys in the US.

So, I am starting this thread to post my stock settings (which werent good IMO) and now I will continue to update as I get the Ohlins stuff installed and start tweaking. My first trackday on the bike is scheduled April 24th 2016 at Fontana (Auto Club Speedway) my favorite track.

I will be running Michelin Evo slicks (190) with the new suspension.
 

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Gian11
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1,576 Posts
had been looking forward to a thread like this. I got same ohlins just installed although (10.0 and 10.5) springs installed as recommended by SBU. I´m 210lbs with gear. My bike with stock ohlins settings is SUPER STIFF... something that scared me a lot when those spring rates were recommmend too.
I´m doing my first track day mid April so hopefully I can manage to improve it a bit and take info from this thread as it gets populated.
 

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wanna B on the Track
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1,099 Posts
Just order the same Ohlins set up. 183 w/o gear. I got the .975 springs. A friend uses this on his CMRA race bike. I'm going to run his settings as a starting point. I'll update with his set up when i get it.

Thanks for starting one for us NON M guys
 

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Racer - WERA Expert # 125
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720 Posts
UB6IB9, what tires are you running? What pressures? When you say no grip at the front, what are you experiencing? What is your ride height, compared to stock for the front and rear?
 

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2015 R1, 2008 R6
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445 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
UB6IB9, what tires are you running? What pressures? When you say no grip at the front, what are you experiencing? What is your ride height, compared to stock for the front and rear?
For the street I am running a Michelin DOT Evo 29psi cold. I have an old Pirrelli slick takeoff on the rear 24psi cold.

I dropped the rear ride height to one thread showing, then the tuner had my drop the front forks to 2nd line to balance. I liked the height of the bike, but it put too much weight on the rear and handled even worse.

So I put the forks back to 1 line showing, raised the ride height in rear back up, but still seems like there isnt enough front end weight. feels like the front wants to tuck, and I am struggling to hold a tight line post appex (drifts). so this makes me tip-toe through corners as I have no confidence when I cant feel what the front end is doing.

I dropped the bike off this morning to the tuner to install all the Ohlins.

I am not going to try and drop the rear ride height, as I have been told my numerous people now that this R1 does not like being set up like that. Forget old R1 setup.

I know the track will be better with faster corners, compared to tight technical canyon turns, but normally I can rail through those too. This bike wont allow for that yet.:scared
 

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Racer - WERA Expert # 125
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720 Posts
Well the old bike didn't like the rear low either.

There are lots of things going on here. Not sure why you would want the rear lower. Stock the R1/M actually needs to be about 1-2 mm higher, this can be solved by going with a set of Pirelli Diablo Supercorsa SP (street tires). I ran them at 31 (F) 28 (R). I recommend you switch to these tires. They are fantastic and work VERY well and when you go to the track the equivalent slick doesn't "feel" any different from a geometry perspective.

Now, the NEW R1/M actually sits a little lower in the rear that the last generation but like I said it can benefit from a slight increase in rear ride height. Since the stock rear shock isn't adjustable for length this can only be done with a change in tire (overall diameter) or a shim (have not tried a shim on this bike).

This will solve your problems.....

1.) Set the fork height at stock and follow the procedure to properly align the front wheel (service manual), then set the rear shock at stock length, eye to eye. Ohlins will likely have this info on the spec card but keep in mind the shock has a top out spring so you need to set shock length with the bike on jack stands and have someone pull down the swingarm to get the full length of the shock.

2.) Get another set of tires, Pirelli is the way to go IMHO. If you are using the bike for street and track this really is the way to go as you won't have to change geometry. If track only, any slick works great. Pick your poison, they all have different advantages/disadvantages.
Race tires are set with HOT pressures generally....I recommend SC1 (more grip) or SC2 compounds front and rear. Front hot pressure 34 (HOT) off the warmers for SC1 and 33 (HOT) for SC2. Rear is 25 (HOT) for either compound.

3.) Make sure your bike sag and rider sag are correct. I recommend about 40 mm front (rider sag) and 30 mm rear (rider sag). The bike should sag under its own weight 20-30 mm front, 10-15 mm rear.

You describe a lack of grip and the sensation of tucking when leaned over.....usually this is an issue with a lack of trail, your ride height is likely too low in the front (meaning too much fork tube is above the top clamp) or the rear is too high OR you have the preload set in a way that doesn't give you the rider sag settings I described. These are a starting point but considered universally acceptable for a sport bike.

Changing shock length at the rear of the bike does different things than changing the fork height.

I say start here. I can get the bike working like a dream for you BUT you have to start with a known setting and then modify from there based on the feedback you provide after riding. Ohlins also makes some suggestions on the REB/COMP front and rear.....START THERE.

I live in Irvine and I help many people with this sort of thing so let me know when you are ready.
 

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Braaaapppp!
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40 Posts
I had the same feeling with bike not finishing corners well and vague feeling...added rear ride height and problem solved.
 

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Braaaapppp!
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40 Posts
Kneedragger, the stock rear shock does have ride height adjustment. There's a nut at the bottom of the shock but you have to remove the linkage to get to it properly...loosen it and extend the shock length as desired. Worked perfect for me and the bike is feels great now.
 

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Racer - WERA Expert # 125
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720 Posts
@regal848, do you have the R1 or R1M? I bought the M and sadly the rear shock isn't adjustable for length as delivered from the manufacturer, however, there is a race kit available to remedy this issue....

Yamaha R1M Race kit
This kit optimizes the Yamaha R1M Öhlins Mechatronics suspension for race use. The kit contains length adjustable end-eye with a new shaft and piston for the Öhlins OEM shock as well as preload tubes for extending the fork stroke to 130 mm by removing internal spacers.
 

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2015 R1, 2008 R6
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445 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
The bike is currently getting all the Ohlins gear installed, so I wont have a chance to go back and re-set the stock stuff.

I think one of my problems was trying to get the rear to sit lower. Just to be clear, my last R1 was a 2005. Fantastic bike. I switched to R6 and had been riding them until YAMAHA decided to delay the R6 makeover another year. So I bought the new R1. Just as Regal stated it does have ride height adjustment on the stock shock but is a PITA to adjust. Kyle racing said they will set the bike with a solid base setting and just go ride it after sag is setup.

I will get a quick test run on the mountain this weekend then tearing it down for race glass.

I run Michelins, I was sponsored by them many moons ago and just like Yamaha will live and die with them. Im not happy they went away from the V profile front tire, but still have good front end feedback (previously).


This thread is prmarily for guys who are/have upgraded the base model to Ohlins suspension and can share good/bad information and settings. I am moving past the stock stuff, and hoping that raising the rear ride height higher will clean up the front end feel and the drift problem.
I appreciate all your input and your close to me so might hit you up if I struggle still.
 

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Racer - WERA Expert # 125
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720 Posts
@UB6IB9, happy to help. What I meant by go back to stock height is find out where the bike is delivered as stock and work from that point. This should be easy enough to find out.

Michelin makes great tires, they just don't have the best street tire IMHO but they did before the Pirelli DSC. I ran the the Power SuperSport and it was pretty good! I just dig the fact that I have a consistent feel from the street to race tire and I don't have to change geometery. btw, you should see the Vee shape to the 16" front Michelin Supermoto race tire, it's pretty nice and incredibly sticky.

I think since Michelin is back in MotoGP and things seem to be going well their tires may be giving Pirelli a run for their money soon....time will tell. Last set of Michelin slicks I ran was the Power Slick and that was two years ago. The front was fine but the rear didn't have the outright grip of the Dunlop or Pirelli but was better than the last gen Bridgestone slick.

Good luck and let us know....
 

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Braaaapppp!
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40 Posts
@UB yeah I understand about the thread intent but chimed in because an Ohlins set up at the same ride height as stock will probably yield very similar feel to the stock geometry I would think. It may not be as pronounced and/or maybe there's better feel from the Ohlins parts but the tendency to run wide and the vague front feel will probably still be there.

Test it out and see what works for you but don't be afraid to make a significant change in the rear height, like +5mm or more to get the feel you're looking for. I've ridden/raced the bike at Chuckwalla and Streets since the change and there are zero issues with taking any line I want to, it really transformed the bike for me.
 

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2015 R1, 2008 R6
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445 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
@UB yeah I understand about the thread intent but chimed in because an Ohlins set up at the same ride height as stock will probably yield very similar feel to the stock geometry I would think. It may not be as pronounced and/or maybe there's better feel from the Ohlins parts but the tendency to run wide and the vague front feel will probably still be there.

Test it out and see what works for you but don't be afraid to make a significant change in the rear height, like +5mm or more to get the feel you're looking for. I've ridden/raced the bike at Chuckwalla and Streets since the change and there are zero issues with taking any line I want to, it really transformed the bike for me.
Thanks Regal and completely understand about the stock height, regardless of brand of shock. I will start with stock settings and test it out, but the general concensus is the rear needs more height. When I first tuned the bike I went the wrong way and the bike was just poo poo to ride and completely dissapointed.

This thread is exactly for the information you guys are providing so good discussions. Cant wait to get this thing on the track!
 

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Gian11
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1,576 Posts
The bike is currently getting all the Ohlins gear installed, so I wont have a chance to go back and re-set the stock stuff.

I think one of my problems was trying to get the rear to sit lower. Just to be clear, my last R1 was a 2005. Fantastic bike. I switched to R6 and had been riding them until YAMAHA decided to delay the R6 makeover another year. So I bought the new R1. Just as Regal stated it does have ride height adjustment on the stock shock but is a PITA to adjust. Kyle racing said they will set the bike with a solid base setting and just go ride it after sag is setup.

I will get a quick test run on the mountain this weekend then tearing it down for race glass.

I run Michelins, I was sponsored by them many moons ago and just like Yamaha will live and die with them. Im not happy they went away from the V profile front tire, but still have good front end feedback (previously).


This thread is prmarily for guys who are/have upgraded the base model to Ohlins suspension and can share good/bad information and settings. I am moving past the stock stuff, and hoping that raising the rear ride height higher will clean up the front end feel and the drift problem.
I appreciate all your input and your close to me so might hit you up if I struggle still.
appreciate if you can share that kyle racing baseline setup when you get it back. I´m currently not trusting my front at all. It is at the oem ride height settings and ohlins manual recommened comp/reb... and I´m still feeling scared of tucking it in.
 

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2015 R1, 2008 R6
Joined
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445 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
appreciate if you can share that kyle racing baseline setup when you get it back. I´m currently not trusting my front at all. It is at the oem ride height settings and ohlins manual recommened comp/reb... and I´m still feeling scared of tucking it in.
Will do, FYI Kyle racing told me that after I ride it with stock settings, that I will end up putting the front forks flush. and raising the rear higher. But I must ride it stock settings first.

What tires are you running?
 

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2015 R1, 2008 R6
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445 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
has anyone tried ktech stuff?
Ktech is super popular in Europe, and the only reason I went with Ohlins is for the resale value. Everyone knows the Ohlins name and it will be easier to sell if I move on from the R1.

The performance is supposed to be on-par with Ohlins.
 

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Gian11
Joined
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1,576 Posts
appreciate if you can share that kyle racing baseline setup when you get it back. I´m currently not trusting my front at all. It is at the oem ride height settings and ohlins manual recommened comp/reb... and I´m still feeling scared of tucking it in.
Will do, FYI Kyle racing told me that after I ride it with stock settings, that I will end up putting the front forks flush. and raising the rear higher. But I must ride it stock settings first.

What tires are you running?
Dunlop d212gp pro currently.
 
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