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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi guys,

After combing parts schematics of:
2016 R1 (14200rpm redline)
2016 R1S (12200rpm redline)
2013 R1 (13700rpm redline)

I have come to the conclusion the Valve Spring and retainer setup of the 2016 r1s and 2013 r1 are similar.

This leads me to my question:
HAS ANYONE SUCCESSFULLY INCREASED REDLINE ON THE R1S AND MONITORED FOR ANY ISSUES OVER A "LONG TERM" PERIOD?

I have spoken with one other R1S owner and he stated he increased his redline to 12700 with his PCV.

I have the FTECU setup with activetune. I have not touched the redline. I didn't want anything to break. My motor now has 5300 miles on it and has had two oil changes. I am ready to start looking into increasing the redline.

The connecting rods are basically the same strength and are merely a weight difference only.

The Valve Spring setup is really what seems to help prevent valve float.

So fellow r1 owners, how much is possible?

Again, the 2013 r1 valvetrain is basically the same as the 2016 r1s except for the difference in how the valve is actually opened and closed (pads vs lifter cap).

Someone has got to know someone that has significantly increased the rev limit on the r1s.

That being said, MANY bikes out there that rev above 13000 rpm use the same valve spring setup as my 2016 r1s. Is it just manufacturer mumbo jumbo?

Please share your experiences guys.

Thanks.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Why do you feel the need to increase the red line? You won't make anymore power.
That is not accurate.

When dyno tuning the bike, you will find the power curve is very similar to the "true" r1 motor with an abrupt rev limit while the bike is still building considerable power.

In stock form, without fueling adjustments, yes it is pointless but anyone that has dyno tuned above 11000 rpm on the "cp4" motor has found that 185+ hp as attainable. I have personally seen a dyno sheet showing 188 hp with the r1s using a pcv. I have ftecu bike kit and activetune which I feel is even better. In addition my mods include 3/4 exhaust, o2 removal, emissions removal, exup removal, intake flapper removal, and an air filter.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I expect Yamaha set the limit to reduce the peak power compared to the R1. Easier than detuning it, although they could fit the FZ1 motor now.
Well technically they did detune it in a way.

Let's hear some experiences people. What are you guys doing to your r1s? Has anyone heard of anyone blowing motors or anything at all?

I have literally found nothing at all either way
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
but why...? the dollars you saved to get the S will be spent anyway trying to do this safely.

I doubt you will find much people here that have done this.
There are two scenarios:

1. Buy the cam springs and upgraded retainer/seats
2. Increase the redline in the tune only

For me, the "tune" scenario is free and the valve spring scenario is fairly unlikely especially considering the entire yec kit of valve springs and retainers can be had for around $1000

I bought the s for many reasons. That being said these types of mods I have done to every motorcycle I owned. I also usually replace wheels, forks, rear shocks, chain + sprockets (520) and brake pads (last two are not much of a mod I know). This is in addition to all the other stuff I have done already.

When it comes down to it, I chose the s model because most of the "lower quality" parts were going to be sold anyway.

For those that may not be aware, the ftecu flash of the r1s has map resolution all the way up to 15000 rpm with timing and fuel values defined.

Some one has to know something. Bike nights, meets, track days, dyno days, group rides, etc some one has to have heard something tangible.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
Camshaft part numbers are also different.

So far I've confirmed the cams, valve springs and retainers, and conrods and crank are different part numbers.

The "why" argument now holds some merit in this case. With mismatched cams and valve springs, the benefits are slightly less.

It may be the complete yec cam and Valve Spring set is really the best option.
 

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the ftecu map that goes up to 15k is probably because its for an r1 they just changed the limiter. the old r1 has steel rods as well and my redline was 14.5 for years no issues. the R1S could definitely go higher but the cams are different the power band it aimed slightly lower for street performance. there probably isn't a ton to be gained by raising it if the cams aren't supposed to make power in that rpm range. that being said i know you could pickup some standard R1 cams and springs from people removing them for cheap.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
the ftecu map that goes up to 15k is probably because its for an r1 they just changed the limiter. the old r1 has steel rods as well and my redline was 14.5 for years no issues. the R1S could definitely go higher but the cams are different the power band it aimed slightly lower for street performance. there probably isn't a ton to be gained by raising it if the cams aren't supposed to make power in that rpm range. that being said i know you could pickup some standard R1 cams and springs from people removing them for cheap.
Exactly my point.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Well well well.

As it turns out, the 2016 r1s cams were used in both the 2015 r1 and r1m. To my knowledge both those bikes have the 14200 rpm redline from the factory.

In addition more good news. The 2017 r1 and r1m use a new dual Valve Spring setup and the cost to purchase all the valve springs, retainers, and the rocker shaft are a fraction or the 2016 parts price. So unless I buy the 2016 valve springs used, I will be switching to the new Valve Spring setup.

That being said, this mod is looking to be relatively easy for me. Since the cams are identical, it should be as simple as just replacing the valve springs and turning up the redline. It was my initial understanding the cam was the limitation (like an fz1) but the cam is identical to the 2015 r1. This is very good news for those of us that want the proper redline.

I am under the impression that there is a difference in the rod weight but not strength. For that reason I plan on running at least the cp3 redline (13750) with just the Valve Spring swap as they have steel rods. Honestly 14100 is probably what I will aim for.

What do you guys think is possible with a dual Valve Spring setup?
 

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I'm just guessing but you're probably going to be able to get your goal of a higher redline. Now I'm also guessing that with the R1S engine yamaha turned the redline down for a bit of longevity being of a lower spec in terms of parts. You will be able to rev higher but you may not be able to get 10 yrs/50000km out of the engine. Just my guess though.

Honestly I shift my 2015 R1 below 13000 most times anyways. Prob closer to 12,000. That's on track. I might stretch the gear out if inbetween shifts in certain sections.

You never mentioned are you tracking this bike? Or is this just for fun on the street?
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I'm just guessing but you're probably going to be able to get your goal of a higher redline. Now I'm also guessing that with the R1S engine yamaha turned the redline down for a bit of longevity being of a lower spec in terms of parts. You will be able to rev higher but you may not be able to get 10 yrs/50000km out of the engine. Just my guess though.

Honestly I shift my 2015 R1 below 13000 most times anyways. Prob closer to 12,000. That's on track. I might stretch the gear out if inbetween shifts in certain sections.

You never mentioned are you tracking this bike? Or is this just for fun on the street?
This bike is used like 99% of the time for street use/daily commute/back roads. Maybe 1 track day per year.

The problem is I hit the redline ALL THE TIME. I shift mostly by ear. Or power curve. If you ever ride an r1s you will understand what I mean. It feels like you have to shift a split second after making power.

Your statement is accurate. The longevity of the motor will be compromised if I do not either knife edge the crank or replace it with the r1 crank which has a bit of a basic weight reduction/knife edge. I highly doubt I will ever change the rods unless I damage them or need new piston rings. But crank removal and valve Spring mods are no sweat at all.

To elaborate or clarify:
The ONLY discernible differences on the r1s motors are:

1. Different engine case covers (enhances engine performance by zero)
2. Difference in crank with slight "knife edge" on the "standard" r1
3. Difference in conrod construction and weight (but not necessarily any difference in strength)(my opinion is with crank replacement, 14200 redline should be feasible, possibly up to 13750 or so without crank)
4. Drastic difference in Valve springs, retainers, and rocker shafts (this is the huge mod in my case, this is the most beneficial of any mods listed)

That's it. Transmission is identical, r1s top speed is rpm limited.

If I just removed my crank and had it knife edged, it should more than offset the increase in rod weight.

This will be done in two separate steps, most likely with a good deal of time between the two:

1. Address the head with the valvetrain upgrades
2. Possibly only knife-edge the crank

I do not have a 2016 or 2017 specific service manual. If anyone has one please let me know, I have only been able to find the 2015 one. I would like to know the crank specs between models (it is my understanding the stroke is identical) as I would like to confirm my "weight savings is the only difference between the two cranks" theory.

Can anyone confirm this?
 

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For the street I really have no idea why you are bothering with all this. The bike makes more than enough power for 95% of people who ride them and if you are changing gears at redline you are never making it out of 3rd gear for most of your riding, it's 90mph+ in first gear.
I would be spending money on things that will make far more difference to you, such as suspension, wheels , brakes etc.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
For the street I really have no idea why you are bothering with all this. The bike makes more than enough power for 95% of people who ride them and if you are changing gears at redline you are never making it out of 3rd gear for most of your riding, it's 90mph+ in first gear.
I would be spending money on things that will make far more difference to you, such as suspension, wheels , brakes etc.
That was my original plan, in addition to the monthly payment scenario.

Try riding one for a while, you'll understand. It just feels unnatural for it to force the shift so soon.

The cost for parts is minimal and I do all my own work. I like to tinker. I believe in value but also believe in making the most of what I have. I will not be buying another bike for another 10 years (my last bike was a 2006 r1) and this is something I planned on doing from the beginning. After further research, the parts list has just gotten shorter and shorter.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Another reason why I'm doing this is to show other owners of the r1s it is possible. I know people left and right that are selling 2016 r1s's for like $11000 because people think it's such a downgrade. It's sad really. Like 90% of the motor is identical. The rotating assembly and valvetrain seem to be the only differences minus the case covers.
 
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