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I rocked in Iraq
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I know this subject is mentioned in other threads, but with no real tips on how to. I am installing my own Graves Cam in my 03 but I want to get my facts strait. Maybe these questions can help others.

1 Do have to remove all lash from all cylinders when timing a cam?

2 Do you only adjust the cam with #1 cylinder or do you check it on all to be sure?

3 If you use the GMS settings, do you really need to check P to V clearances?

4 What is the best method for checking P to V Clearances?

If Mr. Graves could answer these it might save his tech support some time on the phone, if anyone else knows or has done this task please share your experience.
 

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Blue is best
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If you've never done cam timing before you have a bit of a job ahead of you. The Graves kit also should include valve springs and an adjustable sprocket for the intake. To install it you will have to

1) Remove engine from bike
2) Remove head
3) Remove intake valves, install intake valves with the new springs and valve seals
4) Reinstall head with new gasket. You could use a YEC gasket for a little more compression.
5) You will now have to time the cams to 112 deg intake and 104 exhaust (with the stock gasket). With the YEC gasket you should check the piston to valve clearance by using modeling clay in the piston pockets. To time the cams yourself you will also need a dial indicator if you dont already have one.
6) Reinstall motor

As you can see it is not a job if you don't know what you are doing, this is serious business. If you dont have the tools or ability my advice would be to pull the motor and take it to a reputable bike shop for installation. If you do decide to tackle it yourself get a shop manual, read up on how to time cams and make sure to ask a lot of questions if you dont know.

Good Luck.
 

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I rocked in Iraq
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I have the tools, a dial indicator, degree wheel, positive stop tool, detailed shop manual and I have read up on cam timing. I have been working on motors for a long time and I am aircraft tech now. The principal is easy to me, those few specific questions are what I need to know to get started. I plan to take my time and do it right, double checking along the way.
 

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Blue is best
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YzRacer212 said:
I know this subject is mentioned in other threads, but with no real tips on how to. I am installing my own Graves Cam in my 03 but I want to get my facts strait. Maybe these questions can help others.

1 Do have to remove all lash from all cylinders when timing a cam?

No.

2 Do you only adjust the cam with #1 cylinder or do you check it
on all to be sure?

#1 is fine

3 If you use the GMS settings, do you really need to check P to V clearances?

If you change something else (head gasket) or have the head skimmed then you should check the p to v.

4 What is the best method for checking P to V Clearances?

With the head removed get some modelling clay and put then in the valve pockets. Reassemble, time the cams, rotate the engine over and then disassemble. The thickness of the clay will be your p to v clearance, .040" for intake and .080" for exhaust.
 

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I rocked in Iraq
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks for those tips Yamaguy, I read on Webcams instructions it says to remove valve clearance so you can find your .050 lift and then set the cam. When you check your P to V, do you torque the head or just snug it down? I haven't decided which gasket I am going to use, I want to maintain reliability so I may use the stock gasket.
 

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Setting 0 lash is ok if you have an older screw adjustment for the valve clearance but a lot of work if you have shim and bucket like the R1 (and all current bikes). You should use the valve clearance you already have to set the lobe centers.

When claying the engine torque the head to specs, you want to duplicate what you will be using when the engine is running.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Here is the response I got from Graves:

Thank you for your interest in Graves Motorsports. Below is the information you requested, if you have any further questions please feel free to contact me.

1. Valve clearance must be checked on all valves, set valve clearance then set cam timing.
2. Yes, use the #1 cylinder as your base line reference.
3. Yes, you should always double check Piston-to-Valve (P-to-V) clearance when installing new cams.
4. There are two methods to check P-to-V clearance, the "crush" test method (using a piece of solder inserted between the valve and piston) or using a dial indicator (fully depressing the buckets/valves so they touch the pistons, then backing off the shims for proper clearance).
5. Yes, the head MUST be torqued for proper checking of the clearance. Under most circumstances the gasket should be fine to reuse while checking the P-to-V clearance
 

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YzRacer212 said:
Here is the response I got from Graves:

Thank you for your interest in Graves Motorsports. Below is the information you requested, if you have any further questions please feel free to contact me.

1. Valve clearance must be checked on all valves, set valve clearance then set cam timing.

As we said

2. Yes, use the #1 cylinder as your base line reference.

3. Yes, you should always double check Piston-to-Valve (P-to-V) clearance when installing new cams.

Not always necessary if you have proven #'s to use and are sure about what you are doing, but as long as you have the engine out it may as well be done.

4. There are two methods to check P-to-V clearance, the "crush" test method (using a piece of solder inserted between the valve and piston) or using a dial indicator (fully depressing the buckets/valves so they touch the pistons, then backing off the shims for proper clearance). don't do this one, too prone to error. Remove the head and use clay or solder. If you use the solder method you need to use the flux core type. Take a lighter heat up the solder and let the flux flow out of the piece you want to use. That way it will crush easier as it will be hollow.

5. Yes, the head MUST be torqued for proper checking of the clearance. Under most circumstances the gasket should be fine to reuse while checking the P-to-V clearance
Gaskets can be reused if the engine is not run (heated up).
 
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