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Discussion Starter #1
Alright, we all remember our FIRST TIME. When and where did you drag your knee for the first time?

I'll go first. 2001 during my WMRC (Washington Motorcycle Racing Association) new racer orientation program. It wasn't on an actual track but an airport runway? (a long time ago, lol) set up with cones and a makeshift track and I was railing around with no idea what I was actually doing, but doing it quickly and accidently dragged my knee! Scared the crap out of me but been doing it consistently since ;)

Feel free to add what you believe are the key components required to successfully drag a knee. Is it body position only or are there skills/techniques that can help.
 

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Venom X/O
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My first time was an off ramp off the local highway leading into a National Forest. Done by accident actually. At that time I carried too much corner speed for my skill level and was forced to lean more or ride off. I chose the lean and voila, scared the crap outta me. Thankfully I had riding pants with sliders. After that date I started reading books and watching videos for road racing, and that’s all she wrote.
 

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May 2018 at NC Bike, turn 11.... scared the shit out of me... once I realized what I had done, did fastest lap back to 11 to do it again...
 

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Route 60 in VA. East side of the Blue Ridge Parkway headed up the mountain. Thought I was the shit and a bag of chips.

Then I started in the novice group at a track the next year and realized I was slow and knew almost nothing, ha ha. It’s better now.
 

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Some how I made it into advanced group and never planted a knee on the deck...(Well except for those two times I was doing it wrong....crashing ....ironically neither time had anything to do with trying to drag a knee)....I blame my short legs?
 

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Horsepower whisperer
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Never have. And I don't care. 😁
 
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Discussion Starter #7
My first time was an off ramp off the local highway leading into a National Forest. Done by accident actually. At that time I carried too much corner speed for my skill level and was forced to lean more or ride off. I chose the lean and voila, scared the crap outta me. Thankfully I had riding pants with sliders. After that date I started reading books and watching videos for road racing, and that’s all she wrote.
I like that you know exactly what your error was and that you took some time to try and learn proper technique so it wouldn't happen again. This is a common crash scenario that we see at the Superbike School where riders get into a corner too hot and are forced to lean the bike over more. Often times they are already at the max lean angle (usually due to poor technique) and that extra little lean pushes them over the edge to a crash. Proper body position can really help with this- why do riders hang off and drag knees anyway?

Somehow I made it into the advanced group and never planted a knee on the deck...(Well except for those two times I was doing it wrong....crashing ....ironically neither time had anything to do with trying to drag a knee)....I blame my short legs?
You can blame your short legs all you want ;) but what else can contribute to whether or not you get your knee down? (Besides body position?)

Oh, and I have short legs too. :)
 

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being slow! :unsure: on a tall bike....When my BP got better and I went faster a bit faster I got further from getting my knee on the deck....because the bike stood up more....
 

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Venom X/O
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I like that you know exactly what your error was and that you took some time to try and learn proper technique so it wouldn't happen again. This is a common crash scenario that we see at the Superbike School where riders get into a corner too hot and are forced to lean the bike over more. Often times they are already at the max lean angle (usually due to poor technique) and that extra little lean pushes them over the edge to a crash. Proper body position can really help with this- why do riders hang off and drag knees anyway?



You can blame your short legs all you want ;) but what else can contribute to whether or not you get your knee down? (Besides body position?)

Oh, and I have short legs too. :)
Hanging off is actually to lessen lean angle... initially. Then it becomes an equation of action and reaction. You lean off to increase edge grip, and create stability through the turn. Then the faster you get the more you you are required to lean to make the turn, so you change the center of gravity on the bike by hanging off more, create stability through the turn. Then it becomes a giant equation of how much are you willing to hang off and lean versus how fast are you willing to go to make it through the turn LOL
 

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Alright, we all remember our FIRST TIME. When and where did you drag your knee for the first time?

I'll go first. 2001 during my WMRC (Washington Motorcycle Racing Association) new racer orientation program. It wasn't on an actual track but an airport runway? (a long time ago, lol) set up with cones and a makeshift track and I was railing around with no idea what I was actually doing, but doing it quickly and accidently dragged my knee! Scared the crap out of me but been doing it consistently since ;)

Feel free to add what you believe are the key components required to successfully drag a knee. Is it body position only or are there skills/techniques that can help.
March this year after 3rd ride out! Big smiles till exited roundabout to see the old bill on slip road pulled up 😱 I got gestured to pull over and informed that although it’s not illegal my rather tiny number plate was! Smile to a frown and one hundred pounds down! 😡
 

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March this year after 3rd ride out! Big smiles till exited roundabout to see the old bill on slip road pulled up 😱 I got gestured to pull over and informed that although it’s not illegal my rather tiny number plate was! Smile to a frown and one hundred pounds down! 😡
 

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Late 90's on a 1990 FZR 1000 on the Cherohala Parkway between Tellico Plains, Tennessee and Robbinsville, North Carolina. Had no idea what the weird sensation was at first, then I realized!! Was dragging both knees by the end of the weekend!!
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Hanging off is actually to lessen lean angle... initially. Then it becomes an equation of action and reaction. You lean off to increase edge grip, and create stability through the turn. Then the faster you get the more you you are required to lean to make the turn, so you change the center of gravity on the bike by hanging off more, create stability through the turn. Then it becomes a giant equation of how much are you willing to hang off and lean versus how fast are you willing to go to make it through the turn LOL
well said. It's a misunderstanding that a lot of people have, that hanging off gets the bike to lean more....when actually it reduces lean angle. What about how fast or slow you turn the bike? Does the steering rate affect whether or not you will be able to get your knee down or not?
 

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Venom X/O
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well said. It's a misunderstanding that a lot of people have, that hanging off gets the bike to lean more....when actually it reduces lean angle. What about how fast or slow you turn the bike? Does the steering rate affect whether or not you will be able to get your knee down or not?
Well, that depends on what you mean by steer. Steer the bars? Steer with the rear wheel? Steer with your feet on the pegs? Counter-steering will definitely get you down at angle faster, but speed doesn’t matter as much unless we are talking about extreme speed or extremely slow. steering with the rear wheel will definitely take lean angle out, at any speed, and at rapid rates. Steering with your feet is a little different, but it’s affecting lean angle at speed.

just regular counter steering can really get you low, and fast. But the faster you’re going forward, the more effort it'll take to get the bike over for the turn. And all that comes into account before we even start talking about trail braking 😱. Lol
 

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Something I have been struggling with is my toe hits before my knee.

I have a few pics from the TD photog took that I screen shot, and you can clearly see that my toe and knee are on the same plane, but the toe is slightly lower.

Yes, the ball of my foot is on the end of the peg. I can move the peg up a notch, but it makes my knee/leg quite uncomfortable, which makes it harder to move around. Any other ideas?



I won't post the pic because I didn't pay for it....but you could pm me ;-)
 

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Summer 2015, Mulholland Drive @ The Snake.

I was ripping up and down The Snake getting a little faster each time, and then I finally carried enough speed coming up the hill when my left knee puck lightly grazed the ground.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Well, that depends on what you mean by steer. Steer the bars? Steer with the rear wheel? Steer with your feet on the pegs? Counter-steering will definitely get you down at angle faster, but speed doesn’t matter as much unless we are talking about extreme speed or extremely slow. steering with the rear wheel will definitely take lean angle out, at any speed, and at rapid rates. Steering with your feet is a little different, but it’s affecting lean angle at speed.

just regular counter steering can really get you low, and fast. But the faster you’re going forward, the more effort it'll take to get the bike over for the turn. And all that comes into account before we even start talking about trail braking 😱. Lol
Steering means steering..... "to guide or control the movement of a vehicle."

I'm not even sure what you are talking about up above. Steering with your feet? I'm just asking whether you will have the same opportunity to get your knee down if you turn the bike slowly vs someone that is turning the bike more quickly.....

And by steering, I mean counter-steering the bike.
 

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Venom X/O
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Steering means steering..... "to guide or control the movement of a vehicle."

I'm not even sure what you are talking about up above. Steering with your feet? I'm just asking whether you will have the same opportunity to get your knee down if you turn the bike slowly vs someone that is turning the bike more quickly.....

And by steering, I mean counter-steering the bike.
I’m talking about steering the bike with your feet i.e. pressing on the pegs. In tandem with counter steering, you can do quite much with your feet.
I wasn’t sure how technical you were trying to get, because I was expecting more from your question. Didn’t realize you were asking the simple question.
 

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"toe hit first"

oh that nice; it will rip the tissues in the front of ankle. toes should be on peg, not heel
 
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