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flipper
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1,278 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I must be one of the luckiest guys out riding today as I had two front end slides and saved them both!!

I was out on my favorite twisty road (N85 From Grasse to Castellane in France) which is 80 miles roundtrip 40 miles out and 40 back. It starts of with fast open bends that can be taken kneedown in 3rd gear linked with long twisty canyons. And then you have 12 miles of forested tight twisty road like Palomar in So Cal.
Well I was all pumped up after the first 30 mile section and started on the last 10 miles which starts by going over a fast sweeeping right hander on a bridge. I was cranked over on the bridge when I came around the bend and a farmer had left mud all over the road:scared The front stepped out and I closed the throttle slightly and the front then gripped and I stayed up this all happened pretty fast. and was over before I had time really to think. With my heart pounding a little I carried on and about 5 miles on I was in a really tight section. The road up at this section is at about 4000ft altitude and the road was very damp in places where the trees had kept the sun off the road. I snapped the front into a tight left hander that not just turned really tight but also fell about 5 ft through the turn as the road is really undulating around. I snapped the front over and felt the front slide go light and tuck :scared In a nano second I rolled of the throttle staightened the bars and pushed the bike up and managed to save it!!! It was incredible I saved a front end washout!!! Normally there's no way back once the front wheel has tucked but some how I managed not to go down!!eek
Anyway I took it a little easier after that and got the bike home in one piece. Maybe with my luck today I should go buy a lottery ticket:p ::
 
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Re: Re: Re: Saved a front end slide!!

Redrocket996 said:
Your absolutely right there. I had supercorsas until about 3 weeks ago when I changed to pilot power for the winter and they are no way near as good as the Pirellis :no
Exactly, I dont understand why people think track tires are no good for the cold. They heat up the quickest and stick the best, but last for shit.....I will never go to another type tire again.
 

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Team infractions runner up.
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11,107 Posts
I'm actually a professional at loosing the front end and saving it. My friends don't understand how i do that, and my neither. Well all i know is that i roll off the throttle and i put pressure on the knee who's down to lift back the bike....:dunno :dunno Each time i shit my pants!!! :eek: But it works.

But it happens to often, and that's probaly because i'm doing something wrong. I find out i'm going in turn way to fast, i'm a braking rider, and like to pass my friends on the brake, braking is where i'm really good, trail braking, sometimes back wheel on the air. But because of that i'm going to hot and i sometimes loose the front. I got to hit the track again to correct that, before i kill my lucky ass!!!

Oh and by the way because it scared the shit out of me, now the softest tires i ride are Michelin Pilot Power. If tires can save my life, i'll put the $$$ for it.
 

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WERA/CCS #217
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5,974 Posts
Agreed track tires do offer more stick.. but what scares me more is your riding. Kneedown, 3rd gear blasts and bridges dont sound for a good mix if you end up not saving a front end slide.

I'm not one to preach, I ride about as crazy as the next guy.. but certain places (bridges, guardrails, posts, wet or cold roads, leaves, unknown roads) I definitely calm it down a notch.
 

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WERA/CCS #217
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Johnny.. sounds like youre just a little too aggressive with the trail braking.. try sticker tires also.. Pilot Powers are great.. but definitely dont have Supercorsa or Power Race type stick..
 

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flipper
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1,278 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Yep you're right and I throttled back after the front slide and went into turns slightly slower than I could have. The road that I was riding is seriously biker heaven tough and made to be ridden fast with plenty of grip in general and probably the European equivelant of deals Gap or Palomar or somewhere. My main problem that I have with riding on the roads is cars. They get in the way slow you down [email protected] up your lines and they can seriously hurt if you hit one. So with that in mind if there are a lot of cars about I tend to throttle back a little and watch out for them. :thumbup
 

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Nipping at the big dogs tail
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Saved a front end slide!!

[email protected]@alltimes said:
Exactly, I dont understand why people think track tires are no good for the cold. They heat up the quickest and stick the best, but last for shit.....I will never go to another type tire again.
Because most people don't ride hard enough or fast enough on the street to heat them up in cold weather.
 

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Nipping at the big dogs tail
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Saved a front end slide!!

[email protected]@alltimes said:
Agreed, but dont track tires heat up faster in cold and hot weather, their compound is soft, they must.....?
In my experience, track tires take longer to heat up. Don't know why, since they are supposed to be stickier. I think that they have to be at a specific temperature or heat range to become sticky, but not sure.
 
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Saved a front end slide!!

nee.dragger said:
In my experience, track tires take longer to heat up. Don't know why, since they are supposed to be stickier. I think that they have to be at a specific temperature or heat range to become sticky, but not sure.
You may be right but I can tell you this from exp, when I leave my house lika bat outta hell, I get more initial traction from my race tire than my ole dunlop....:fact
 

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DAMN YOU SHANE
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my question is whne you get off teh gas teh bias of the weight goes up front and would cause it to tuck more. the pilot powers area great STREEET/trackDAy tire. but if you are pusshing real hard yes you can push thm past the breaking point
 

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flipper
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I know that the theory is to prevent loading the front once you've turned the bike it is good to open the throttle through the turn. Normally I power through turns and get the throttle on asap. This was different as it was a tight turn taken at about 35mph and I threw the bike in hard and quick opened the throttle a little and felt the front tuck. So I picked the bike up and lightly rolled off the throttle to save me running wide and just managed to save it.

Anyone who's lost the front knows what it feelws like as the front slides and then the front wheel snaps (turns) back to the inside and normally at that point you just go down. I managed to turn the bars back so the tyre gripped again and push the bike back up. It was a pretty uncomfortable moment and even now I can't help looking at my nice clean bike and just knowing how lucky I was. :yesnod

BTW I took a photo of the road today for Daekwan to see and once I can upload the picture I will. When you see the road and the type of turns there are you'll realise that 3rd gear knee down stuff is not all that crazy.:riding
 

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Nipping at the big dogs tail
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Redrocket996 said:
. . . . I threw the bike in hard and quick opened the throttle a little and felt the front tuck.
If the front wheel tucked while you were on the throttle, then you were turning the bars the wrong way. If you were on the throttle, and turning correctly, you cannot lose or tuck the front wheel. Ask Kenny Roberts Sr, Freddie Spencer, or any motorcycle track school instructor.

Redrocket996 said:
. . . . . lightly rolled off the throttle to save me running wide and just managed to save it.
That is most likely when the front wheel started to tuck, when you rolled off the throttle to prevent running wide. Or you rolled off the throttle enough previously and didn't consciously realize it, to start the front wheel to tuck under.
 

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Layer-3
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Redrocket996 said:
Anyone who's lost the front knows what it feelws like as the front slides and then the front wheel snaps (turns) back to the inside and normally at that point you just go down.
:crash :crash :bash :bash :fact :fact

 

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Bulldogger
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No offense, but you got lucky, thats all:fact
 

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flipper
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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
bigkvn1 said:
No offense, but you got lucky, thats all:fact
Yep and don't I know it.:yesnod

BTW needrager, Thanks for the comments and in general what you said was right but it was still possible to lose the front on the throttle on that turn as it was a tight turn that fell away about 5 foot through the turn so that the start of the turn was at least 5 foot higher than the exit making it very heavy on the front.

My basic mistake was going in too clumsy I had taken the turn much faster in the past but was on different tyres and the road was hot and dry then. That day the road was damp at the start of the turn and I think I was a little apprehensive when approaching the turn. I woke up pretty quick when it was all going seriously wrong though.:scared

I hate winter riding! Too be quite honest I also don't really like these Pilot power tyres at all. They squirm and slide a hell of a lot more than I'm used to.:fire
 

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flipper
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1,278 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Daekwan said:

I'm not one to preach, I ride about as crazy as the next guy.. but certain places (bridges, guardrails, posts, wet or cold roads, leaves, unknown roads) I definitely calm it down a notch.
Yeah I heear what you're saying. This is a photo of the road at the start on the 3rd gear knee down section and I'm sure that at least half the guys on this forum would be scraping their knee sliders on these bends :fact
 

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