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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi, has anyone fitted a thumb brake? I was going to use a Junction valve on the rear master but speaking to a few people they said it would have too much travel.
As much I didn't want to, i bought a rear master that is made to take a thumb and foot brake.
I just wondered if people had experience with either the master or the valve?

Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.
TIA

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SuperbikeUnlimited.com
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I have an IMA set up coming. I can help after I figure out how to do it on mine.

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Hi Tony, I would have gone for that but it seemed expensive, saying that I am sure the full IMA kit comes two masters.
So with my master it worked out more, then i had to sell the pfm thumb brake and get a Hel because of clearance issues.
A lot of people are going for the the two leaver system or just putting a clutch master on them. Some of them, where the clutch is incorporated with the small brake lever look quite smart, it is a tiny lever like on my mtb
You got one of the best makes there Tony, well engineeringed too, it is what i would have gone for but the build was getting out of hand, I think they both are 😂.
I finally getting there, just waiting for the master to come back from Holland, they have built something custom for my requirements, but only have a picture of a similar thing to what they are going to build.
I will be interested in how your fit goes, should be straight forward as it is a proper kit unlike mine.
You having your one foot and thumb, or just thumb Tony?
I will have forgotten how to ride the bike soon, it will be two years this October, but i will be hope I can do a little test even on street if I have to to check a few things.
I hope you are all well, stay safe 👍
 

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SuperbikeUnlimited.com
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All is good thank you.
When you swing a leg over your bike, within a few miles it will all come back.

I am going with the thumb and foot set up. I figured all or nothing



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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Same as me with the foot as well, i got to finish the R1, in fact these will the last few mods and ride more . I really need to spend time on the Aprilia, it hasn't run for three years. I feel it growling at me some times when it see the amount of money and time i spent on the R1. Oh well it has got some nice new bits I got for it the pfm rear race caliper and Cosa Corta clutch master.
I would like your feedback on the Thumb brake and I hope you get to ride it more than we are this year.
Good luck for this 2020 season Tony, stay safe 👏👍
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Hey dog, why not just do the thumb brake only straight line to caliper? Do you really ever use the foot brake?


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Hi Ruben, in my two stroke racing years I never used the rear brake. But since I have been riding four strokes and some advice from my late friend, who was much more talented than me, he used the back brake all the time.
I got it all sorted now, and it the leaver has very little travel on both thumb and foot .
It is what i may progress to, only having a thumb brake.
I would have probably got used to it, I will see how it goes, also mine on street still so I didn't know how I would stand with the Mot.
It's a shame track time abroad was cut abroad, the domestic scene is horrendous atm.
If I had known what was going to happen maybe I would not made such an investment in leathers and bike. But who would think something like this would come and take so much life.
At 61 years old it is just a bit of fun, and I love the engineering side.
Your advice is appreciated always and I am very grateful.
Glad you got a few things sorted and I hope you had a great trip. Have a great day, Rich

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Venom X/O
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It’s always interesting different riding styles. If it wasn’t required, my rear brake wouldn’t exist because I never touch it. I do love the look of a thumb brake tho.

I remember reading about Sylvain Guintoli not using the rear but most riders do, and it made me question my riding style.
“The proof? Guintoli says that in 2014, the year he won the WSBK title, he never touched the rear brake in a race”
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
It’s always interesting different riding styles. If it wasn’t required, my rear brake wouldn’t exist because I never touch it. I do love the look of a thumb brake tho.

I remember reading about Sylvain Guintoli not using the rear but most riders do, and it made me question my riding style.
“The proof? Guintoli says that in 2014, the year he won the WSBK title, he never touched the rear brake in a race”
Hi Chris, here's the man himself talking about the rear brake.
I was like you through all the time I was racing, but things were different, two strokes which had very little engine braking.
Hey anyway take a look

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Great video. I never use the rear so I think I can win WSBK, but I’m not going to be competitive in MotoGP. Lol. For real though, great info on the rear brake usage scenarios. I typically only touch mine when I blow a corner and go off roading.
 

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Venom X/O
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Hi Chris, here's the man himself talking about the rear brake.
I was like you through all the time I was racing, but things were different, two strokes which had very little engine braking.
Hey anyway take a look

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I’ve seen the video previously, and love it. I’m not at that level, but for my local club racing I still rarely touch the rear. I’ll practice that when I’m chasing .10ths not seconds 😂😂
 

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I tried the quick down shift method yesterday at the track as he describedin the video. What a difference! The bike stopped quicker and way more stable. I was impressed, and was able to move my brake markers by ~150ft and for the first time was able to trail brake into the at summit main.

This plus a few other things I was able to drop 0.7s off my pb there.
 
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Just Me.
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I tried the quick down shift method yesterday at the track. What a difference! The bike stopped wicker and way more stable. I was impressed.
Quick downshift method?

As in at marker 5 or 4 or 3, whichever tightens you sphincter muscles the hardest (no ****), grab a handful of clutch, bang down 2 or 3 gears in rapid succession, and let the clutch out? Or, do you have clutchless shifting on you bike?
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I’ve seen the video previously, and love it. I’m not at that level, but for my local club racing I still rarely touch the rear. I’ll practice that when I’m chasing .10ths not seconds
If it was my younger years where I never touched the rear brake pedal, I would have run just one line to the rear caliper like Ruben said, but the fact I use it now i thought I would keep both.
Also the Thumb brake is nowhere has the same strength. They say if you run just one line there's less travel in the Thumb brake lever. But mine is pretty good, saying that Qnium dual master wasn't cheap.
They use them in moto 3 and 2, we saw one of them kids on a moto 3 bike in Spain and he was so fast it was ridiculous

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Quick downshift method?

As in at marker 5 or 4 or 3, which ever tightens you sphincter muscles the hardest (no ****), grab a handful of clutch, bang down 2 or 3 gears in rapid succession, and let the clutch out? Or, do you have clutchless shifting on you bike?
I have a blipper that was new to me and installed this winter, so this season was the first chance I've had to put this method to work. My first two days on track were at Pitt race, and except for one spot where I go down 2 gears I only go down 1 every where else. At summit the main straight is a 5->2 (155-160 down to about 35-40) matter, so this was the first time I really got to test the method.

In the past I have been bliping with my wrist and using the clutch and braking all at the same time, so making all that happen was a much slower process and it always felt really rushed. Therefore, I never was really comfortable with turn one entry.

This time with the blipper, I was able to smoothly get on the brakes at the 5 board and knock out 3 quickly timed down shifts by the 3 board and the last bit of braking felt relaxed and managed. Therefore I could set my speed better, and trail to the apex. The three quick down shifts seemed to help drive the bike down and settle the suspension, rather than just picking the rear off ground and making it feel like it was going over.

Overall it made a measurable difference in the way I now approach similar corners.
 
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I tried the quick down shift method yesterday at the track as he describedin the video. What a difference! The bike stopped quicker and way more stable. I was impressed, and was able to move my brake markers by ~150ft and for the first time was able to trail brake into the at summit main.

This plus a few other things I was able to drop 0.7s off my pb there.
Hi Tad158, well done, has your bike got a slipper clutch?
Mines a 2015 R1, I have always shifted like that on two strokes on track, till I got an Aprilia twin 30 years later, and the engine braking was so strong that I bought a Yoyodyne slipper for it.
It made a tremendous difference, I have the same clutch on my R1, the oem was OK but it engaged later than the Yoyodyne.
Slipper clutches are brilliant, even if you come down the gearbox too quick, the slipper will take it,and you might get it slide a little if you lean it in but it always come back. Also it takes so much strain of the drive train and engine

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Hi Tad158, well done, has your bike got a slipper clutch?
Mines a 2015 R1, I have always shifted like that on two strokes on track, till I got an Aprilia twin 30 years later, and the engine braking was so strong that I bought a Yoyodyne slipper for it.
It made a tremendous difference, I have the same clutch on my R1, the oem was OK but it engaged later than the Yoyodyne.
Slipper clutches are brilliant, even if you come down the gearbox too quick, the slipper will take it,and you might get it slide a little if you lean it in but it always come back. Also it takes so much strain of the drive train and engine

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The 09 has a stock slipper clutch, so that was doing its job.

Ps, thanks for the encouragement. I've been stuck on a plateau all year last year, not improving at that track, and I finally broke through yesterday. So I was pretty pumped up about it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Anyone who doesn't touch the rear brake pedal like you Chris would be ideal for a thumb brake alone.
I still have to get used to the fact it is one or the other, as you can't use both at the same time. But I will learn it, I just didn't like the idea of a fixed pedal, could cause a bit of panic. The only other way was a caliper with two separate chambers and four pads and two lines like some moto gp have,where you can use both.
Too much for an old dog like me😂👍.
If I could have afforded it would have bought the scooter and the clutch all in one by PFM, not long after I bought mine someone had one for sale, sod's law 😁.
They say it feels more natural to have a scooter brake type leaver than a thumb, will find out soon 😊👍
 
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