Okay I'm trying to fine tune my body poistion while cornering.. I have heard of 2 ways to do it and tried both.. Just wondering what technique everyone else is using and how it works for them..

1st one is to swivel around the tank... I tried this and by far I find it more comfortable and my leg is more hooked up on the gas tank, problem is the knee I'm trying to get down doesn't go but maybe a foot or less from the bike.

2nd one is to scoot my ass back on the seat, I find this position uncomfortable at times and my leg doesn't hook up as solid to the tank, it ends up hooking up near the front of the seat, but I can get my knee down to the ground.

What do you all think? Any suggestion out there??

if you're gonna lean left...your right leg should hug the tank...right arm relaxed. you should put the ball of your left foot on the peg. that will help you extend your left leg to put you knee down. lead with your chin and shoulders.
i learned on a roundabout in the fall. that's why the right side is untouched. it was too cold to go anywhere else and get the right side of the tire up to temp.

but if you have questions about stuff like that. i advise you pick up "Sport Riding Techniques". you'll find it on amazon.com
you won't have any more questions...trust me:thumbup

 

oh yeah and of course your arse should be off the seat. your height will determine how far you have to slide off the seat. i don't have to so much since i'm 6'3. i do anyway. my friend who is pretty short...he looks like his arse isn't even on the seat.

speed is a factor also. 50-60 is a very comfortable speed to play with.

 

I've read 2 books so far and they both contradict one another, just like fellow riders.

Total control by Lee Parks says to hang off and Smooth Riding by Reg Pridmore says to swivel around the tank... I grasp the concept of leaning..

I was wondering which technique does everyone use and the benefits.. Swivel around the tank or scoot your butt back and hang off??

Thanks Adey for your inputs:thumbup

 

oh i see what you're saying. if you hug the tank like that...you're gonna have a hard time putting your knee down. swiveling around the tank...i feel i do that at higher speeds. the faster i go around the circle the more i have to grip the tank to hold on. but my knee is touching still but i'm leaning harder.

at the lower speeds like 50-65mph you can be more relaxed. so you scoot back more...everything else remains the same.

so hugging the tank with your body at slow speeds will make it really hard to put your knee down. your leg won't extend out enough from the bike.

just watch the races...watch their body language thru the turns. notice the difference at high and low speed corners. you'll see what i'm talking about.

 

aaah I get it... That makes sense since I tend to go around the corner faster when I swivel around the tank:yesnod

 

aaah I get it... That makes sense since I tend to go around the corner faster when I swivel around the tank:yesnod

i suggest trying it at 50-60mph. you can relax and fine tune your position. the faster you go, the more you cling to the bike. good luck
lemme see those pucks when you touch :rock :thumbup

 

Keith Code teaches one butt cheek off, maximum, and not wrapping your knee around the tank because your head and body will not be parallel with the center line of the bike. He emphasizes that his approach results in more balanced control of the bike, and quicker transitions when leaning/hanging off left and then right and vise versa.

For example, while leaning/hanging off, your head and body should be in alignment -- head at the 12:00 o'clock position and butt at the 6:00 o'clock position -- parallel to the front and rear of the bike.

I used to wrap my knee around the tank too because it felt more comfortable, but faster lap times doing it Keith's way convinced me otherwise. My improvements came from being able to flick the bike over more quickly as mentioned in the first paragraph.

 

Keith Code teaches one butt cheek off, maximum, and not wrapping your knee around the tank because your head and body will not be parallel with the center line of the bike. He emphasizes that his approach results in more balanced control of the bike, and quicker transitions when leaning/hanging off left and then right and vise versa.

For example, while leaning/hanging off, your head and body should be in alignment -- head at the 12:00 o'clock position and butt at the 6:00 o'clock position -- parallel to the front and rear of the bike.

I used to wrap my knee around the tank too because it felt more comfortable, but faster lap times doing it Keith's way convinced me otherwise. My improvements came from being able to flick the bike over more quickly as mentioned in the first paragraph.

Another good point.... I guess I'm just gonna have to keep experimenting:thumbup

 

One butt cheek off the seat is the maximum you'll ever need properly. Watch the the racers on tv and you'll see they never get off more than that. Nikoto Tamada (sp¿) likes to get off more but that's just his style. In some extreme situations it may require more but that is dependent on the situation.

Personally I only hang off by one cheek. When I'm charging hard into a corner I sit as far forward as I can against the tank to keep weight on the front tire. This helps stabilize the front end. I start to slide back in the seat and transition my weight to the rear as I go through the corner. Putting weight to the rear as you gas out helps stabilize the rear so you don't spin it up.

 

Personally I'm a fan of the Pridmore technique. I don't put much stock into getting my knee down, as you can see in the photo to the left. My inside knee is generally up against the bike. I keep a solid grip on the bike from my ankles to my knees with both legs. I feel it gives me more control and more ground clearance to boot. You'll generally see a straight line from my ankle, to my hips to my elbow to my shoulder...

My last two days at track school (Reg Pridmore's advanced school) I was the only one not trying to get my knee on the ground, and I was passing just about everyone. I don't see any benefit to sticking my knee out unless I want an air brake.

One thing that helped me a bunch was to start the lean with my shoulder and worry more about where my head is than my butt. As I lean into the corner I rotate from the shoulders and let my hips follow.

 

My last two days at track school (Reg Pridmore's advanced school) I was the only one not trying to get my knee on the ground, and I was passing just about everyone. I don't see any benefit to sticking my knee out unless I want an air brake.
.

yeah you don't have to put your knee down. but there is a benefit. you use it to gauge your ground clearance.

and i can tell from the angle of the bike and your position that you speed isn't that fast into the corner.

trust me...the faster you go the more you have to lean. and your knee will touch. if it doesn't then your toe will touch. when it happened to me, i had stock pegs. so my pegs scraped, then toe then my knee. that was because i was hugging the tank with my outside leg.

 

yeah you don't have to put your knee down. but there is a benefit. you use it to gauge your ground clearance.

No question that top racers do judge their ground clearance this way. But I'll bet good money that 90%+ of us mere mortals who get a knee down are doing it by sticking their knee out farther than they have to, and quite often farther than they should be, just to be able to say that they scrapped their knee or to look cool.

If you are artificially putting your knee way out there, it may touch down, but it isn't providing you any useful information as you'll really have a lot more lean left than you'll think you have.

Getting a knee on the pavement has become a status symbol. And frankly, most of the time it's meaningless. I've seen so many guys hanging _way_ too far off their bike, to the point that it upsets their handling and control just to try to get their knee down. They think this makes them faster, while most of the time, a skilled and composed rider will blow right past them without anything touching down...

and i can tell from the angle of the bike and your position that you speed isn't that fast into the corner.

That pic was entering turn 3 of Willow Springs (big track), it was pre-apex and did not happen to catch the maximum lean angle so you can't judge my speed by a single random frame. Believe me, I had the exit of turn 2 nailed that day and way carrying way more speed into 3 than just about anyone (other than Reg and Fred). I was stuffing people into that corner all day long.

The point of the photo (and my comment) wasn't "look how far I can lean!", but an example of a riding form that doesn't emphasize getting a knee down, and in fact prevents it, but still lets you go fast by keeping the bike under control.

trust me...the faster you go the more you have to lean. and your knee will touch. if it doesn't then your toe will touch. when it happened to me, i had stock pegs. so my pegs scraped, then toe then my knee. that was because i was hugging the tank with my outside leg.

My speed is not the issue, I've dragged my toes, and pegs and other parts of the bike (more on my BMW than my R1), but I've never had a knee on the pavement and don't need to (on the street at least, if I were racing I might have a slightly different story...).

My bottom line point here is that getting a knee down doesn't make you a better rider, and doesn't prove that you're faster either. Most riders will benefit more from working on their upper body position (head, shoulders, elbows), followed by their hip and butt position, without worrying about trying to get a knee on the pavement.

For those not riding 10/10ths on a track, there's probably more benefit to be had by keeping a solid grip on the bike with both ankles and knees, than by trying to look cool with your knee in the breeze.

Personally I have a _lot_ of steering input from my ankles (you should see how worn the inside ankles of my boots are) and by keeping both knees on the bike I can shift my body weight back and forth entirely with my legs. This lets me keep my arms relaxed and I don't put any unwanted input into the grips by trying to pull myself back up onto the bike after a corner.

 

i was doing a lot of playing on my last track day. i also have some stomp pads which really help the knee hook up on the tank.
according to kieth cod the weight should be 60% on the rear tire and 40% on the front. and there is no need to drag your knee all the way through the corners.
what i found in my last track day is that if i put my weight on the outside peg, hang one cheak off, try to kiss the mirror, skip the leg to see where i am and then lift it, i was quit well in the corners. i never push it too hard on a track day and what i had been doing was far from what i had been doing in the past and was comfortable with. but by the end of the day i could keep up with the faster guys when i pushed it.
my advice would be to find a nice clover leaf on the high way somewhere and play. after a few passes around your tirs will be good and warm on that one side. just get out there and try it every posible way that you can think of. she what fits you best and stick with it. getting something to be consistant with will be a huge help no matter what you are doing.

 

No question that top racers do judge their ground clearance this way. But I'll bet good money that 90%+ of us mere mortals who get a knee down are doing it by sticking their knee out farther than they have to, and quite often farther than they should be, just to be able to say that they scrapped their knee or to look cool.

If you are artificially putting your knee way out there, it may touch down, but it isn't providing you any useful information as you'll really have a lot more lean left than you'll think you have.

Getting a knee on the pavement has become a status symbol. And frankly, most of the time it's meaningless.

i agree about it becoming a status symbol. but it's not meaningless.



My bottom line point here is that getting a knee down doesn't make you a better rider, and doesn't prove that you're faster either. Most riders will benefit more from working on their upper body position (head, shoulders, elbows), followed by their hip and butt position, without worrying about trying to get a knee on the pavement.

true to some extent...like i said before. the faster you go more lean angle involved. your knee will touch.

For those not riding 10/10ths on a track, there's probably more benefit to be had by keeping a solid grip on the bike with both ankles and knees, than by trying to look cool with your knee in the breeze.

Personally I have a _lot_ of steering input from my ankles (you should see how worn the inside ankles of my boots are) and by keeping both knees on the bike I can shift my body weight back and forth entirely with my legs. This lets me keep my arms relaxed and I don't put any unwanted input into the grips by trying to pull myself back up onto the bike after a corner.

can't type anymore
i'm a little drunk....HAPPY NEW YEAR!:rock

 

But I'll bet good money that 90%+ of us mere mortals who get a knee down are doing it by sticking their knee out farther than they have to, and quite often farther than they should be, just to be able to say that they scrapped their knee or to look cool..

speak for yourself buddy...i fall into the 10%.haha
but seriously...you're right most guys do it for bragging rights.

i just had to learn how to do it. something to add to my arsenal. i was already fast in corners without touching my knee down. but i just wanted to be comfortable hanging off when need be.

i believe you when you say you were blowing people on the corners. i'm sure they were so focused on putting their knee down that they couldn't even corner well.

but uh...sh*t i lost my train of thought. black label is getting to me.haha
what are we talking about again?

 

One of the liabilities of rotating around the tank is that you can't get your outside knee anchored onto the tank. This usually causes one to have to hold themselves up with their arms which makes it very hard to relax your arms. This is not a total absolute rule, but check it out for yourself. Generally speaking you want to get the bulk of your weight down and to the inside of the bike, which means getting your upper body over.

 

Re: Re: Body position when leaned over

if you're gonna lean left...your right leg should hug the tank...right arm relaxed. you should put the ball of your left foot on the peg. that will help you extend your left leg to put you knee down. lead with your chin and shoulders.
i learned on a roundabout in the fall. that's why the right side is untouched. it was too cold to go anywhere else and get the right side of the tire up to temp.

but if you have questions about stuff like that. i advise you pick up "Sport Riding Techniques". you'll find it on amazon.com
you won't have any more questions...trust me:thumbup

posting pics of worn out knee pucks?


:sleep

noobs...:lol

 

Re: Re: Re: Body position when leaned over

posting pics of worn out knee pucks?


:sleep

noobs...:lol

u rather i post pics of your worn out girlfriend?:finger

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Body position when leaned over

u rather i post pics of your worn out girlfriend?:finger

said the man reaching for some lotion...

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Body position when leaned over

said the man reaching for some lotion...

this coming from someone who looks like they have to tinkle in their sig. picture. gayest pose ever.:finger

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Body position when leaned over

u rather i post pics of your worn out girlfriend?:finger

thats original :crash

no need to change the subject, let's keep it on your squidliness. :riding

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Body position when leaned over

thats original :crash

no need to change the subject, let's keep it on your squidliness. :riding

squid i'm not. showing a pic of a worn puck is no different from showing yourself on the track. woo-hoo you've been in a race. hmmm...what else. how bout your original name. "hey world...i'm a kneedragger".

you're a clown...stick to the circus.

 

Which is better to gauge angle, Knee or Toes. I never went to a school and i don't ride on a track (the closest one is 300+ miles away). I learned to use my toes to gauge how fare I am leaning. Should I get a set of pucks and try using the knee? Is it easyier?

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Body position when leaned over

squid i'm not. showing a pic of a worn puck is no different from showing yourself on the track. woo-hoo you've been in a race. hmmm...what else. how bout your original name. "hey world...i'm a kneedragger".

you're a clown...stick to the circus.

struck a nerve did I? :yesnod

An avatar pic is an avatar pic. Its far different to flaunt worn knee pucks as some sort of "right of passage" when someone was asking about body position. :bash

On this forum there are probably 30 variations of the "dragger" name. Everthing from elbow dragger to needragger to leftpinkydragger....

But who is bragging here eh?

i was already fast in corners without touching my knee down. but i just wanted to be comfortable hanging off when need be.

Its ok man. We understand. For some people, highway off-ramp riding is about as good as it gets. You are no doubt fast, after all you always ride up front during group rides right? :riding

 

Which is better to gauge angle, Knee or Toes. I never went to a school and i don't ride on a track (the closest one is 300+ miles away). I learned to use my toes to gauge how fare I am leaning. Should I get a set of pucks and try using the knee? Is it easyier?

If you're dragging toe you probably have duck feet in the corner. That means your foot position is wrong. Keep the balls of your feet on the pegs, not the part between the ankles and toe joints. If you already have your feet in the correct position then your close to maximum lean angle. Work on getting your body off the bike more so that you don't have to lean it that far over. Yes it looks cool but for safety reasons its not practical on the street. If you have correct body and foot position and you still scrape peg the you might be fast so you need to hit the track regardless.