Hello Yves, I'm a race mechanic down in the South of France, previously building lots of Ducatis for the French Pro-twin and Top-Twin championships, and I've just prepared two 2009 Yamaha's for two of my Ducati-rider customers.

The heat problem is not such a problem, but you need to know what class you're racing in as to whether you can fit an oil cooler, which it needs, or not.
The add-on lower water radiators are a good thing to do for sprint racing, as well as a Scott or PC oil-filter, and a good oil, changed after every race.
The fuel injection needs some work, too, running the bike slightly rich to cool it down will increase your consumption, so if you're endurance racing it, keep this in mind.
The YART and GMT bikes had head-gasket problems, but were running around the 78 degree mark before they broke, using only a bigger water radiator.
They don't use oil-coolers because of the risk of stone damage and a crash caused by oil, but I think an oil cooler and fittings, like on Spies bike, is a good investment.

Pay close attention to the fit of the fairings, keep the snug inner-cowl on the sides and shroud the radiator to optimize airflow.

I ran some R1's in European Superstock for years, and usually managed to keep them cooler than most.
A higher pressure cap, 1.5 or 1.8 bar is good, and silicone hoses with good clamps (VERY IMPORTANT !) as well as a fluted, finned alloy tube on the right-hand side coming from the oil/water heat interchanger to the radiator will also help.
I've taken out the thermostat as well, and send the bikes out at 65 degrees C from the pitbox, so they don't overheat waiting on the pre-grill.

Run some of that clear Ardennes rainwater (filtered) or water from a low mineral content source in the radiator, with Motul MoCool or Water-wetter or similar, and change it after every race.
Diluted water doesn't seem to have much calorific efficiency compared to soft water from rain or artesian wells, but don't use bottled mineral water. Too much calcium.
A good overflow bottle with a masked vent is also a good thing, and some fans in the pit box are also useful, for the rider AND the bike....

The sound and feel of the bike is awesome, and my riders were fast straight away on the bike on Friday at Ledenon, appreciating the easy turn in and ability to hold really tight lines, compared to the Ducati, which has a tendency to run wide and push the front.
The engine has slightly less "character" than the Ducat', but it's far more efficient in getting the power down hard.

..and that's what it's all about.:yesnod

 

Hello Crosplaner. Thx for the great info and post! That just about wraps up the necessity for this topic al in one reply!

I understand what you are saying about the extra oil cooler and it seems to make sense.

I"m definitely taking your info with me to the dealer if I go for the R1 and think that based in your info I would start with a combination of a highpressure cap and extra water radiator with an additive in the water.

Thx again for the great info!

 

My pleasure, Yves.
There seems to be a lot of nonsense talked about the 2009 R1, but what I've seen of it in my initial build-up and my riders first impressions indicates that it's a really, really good motorcycle.

Seeing as it's won or finished vice-champion in virtually every national and international superbike or superstock championship in it's first year, I think my observations may be correct...:flex:

Coming from the Ducati, I think you'll really enjoy and understand it a LOT faster than people who have been used to traditional inline 4's.
Good luck.
Maybe we'll see each other in Spain, if you do some Winter testing with Speer or Bikers days ?

 

Crossplaner,
What were you guys using as far as suspension?

 

I have used Matris before too on a Kawasaki ZX10R. Full cartridge front and rear shock. I was quite satisfied with them too. Very good build quility and good performance.

However I tend to be a little more partial towards Ohlins because I feel Ohlins has a more "soft" and "fluent" feel to them in comparison with brands like Matris, Bitubo and WP which feel much "harder" and more "agressive". It's difficult to put in words. I have also found that I can never get quite the same excellent level of tire wear as with Ohlins.

In the mean while the chances of me riding an R1 next season have gone down a bit. I visited 2 dealers last week asking them to quote me for my bike for next year (R1+ all the "trimmings": Ohlins suspension, Ohlins stering damper, cooling rebuild, quick action throttle, brake lines, chain and sprockets, rearsets, reverse shift, quick shift, etc, etc, etc,.... the complete set up) and to my surprise.... not one has gotten back to me. If the quality of service is already this poor when buying the bike I don't even want to know how the customers service will be once I have the bike and something goes wrong...Very disappointing.

 

I agree with you about the Ohlins. Both my riders are slightly hefty, so the Matris works fine, and I set my bikes up like dancers, stiffish springs, not too much pre-load, fairly open hydraulics and go for good ground clearance and fast reaction in mid corner.
Stability is usually OK, but the French tracks are stop-start for the most part.

Customer service for the Yamaha in France is excellent, by far the best, and the overall quality of the dealers is great.
Why don't you get in touch with Martial Garcia at MG Competition ? Tell him what you want, and let him quote you for it.
Try Taz Motorcycles in the UK, as well. They have 2009/2010 R1's at incredible prices, although they have the US spec wiring and CDI, so you'll need the YEC box and kit loom.
If you're not planning on registering it or riding on the road in Belgium, this could be a good way to go, as it's delivered with UK papers and conformity.
Ask for Aaron. Tell him Peter in France sent you.

For the parts, shop around a bit. Mirco Totti does some excellent radiators for the R1, and his price is competitive. Try RTM Imola.

Don't give up on the R1 just yet.....:riding

 

This is an awesome info post... :fact

Thanks guys.

 

I agree -- great read -- thanks much!!!!

 

Crossplaner,

My bike would be bought by my company for fiscal reasons (recup of VAT, some costs,...) so the bike would be registered in Belgium. I need to buy it new from a Belgian dealer.

Maybe I can get your view on the "general specs" of the bike I would like to order?

This is the stuff that I would be putting on the bike from the start:

* Cooling rebuild: high pressure cap, extra radiator and water additive
* Chain/sprocket conversion moving to a 49 rear which should be good for most tracks except mabye Spa, Magny Cours or Hockenheim (although I rode Magny Cours and Hockenheim with a 40 rear on the 1198S this year and this was OK, but gearing is an entirely different discussion)
* Quickshifter
* Rear sets with reverse shift
* Quick action throttle
* Steel brake lines
* Ohlins steering damper
* Ohlins cartridge in front fork
* Ohlin TTX rear
* Leovinci or Akra Y-pipe - just eliminating the cat - I would be keeping the stock header and stock end pipes. I think that spening 3.000 euro on a full Akrapovic line + PC V for "only" +/- 6hp is a lot of money. I am also getting more and more tired of noise issues on most of the tracks in Europe! I have also noticed that keeping the stock end pipes with the black plastic protectors still attached will protect just about half of the bike in case of a low sider!

Obviously the "usual stuff" like race plastic, racing screen, diabolo's, starlane laptimer,... is also planned but that is more esthetics and doesn't influence the performance of the pike that much.

Am I missing something? Is there anything you feel is realy usefull or necessary when racing the R1?

 

No, you've pretty much got the good gear there.

A couple of things.
Run the GB Racing engine case protectors. They're beautifully made and crash well, plus Graham is working on an even better design, coming out in the next couple of months.
For track days, R&G Racing have some great diabolos which are larger than most, but really robust. They also have a good set of heavy-duty crash pucks, but you need to trim the fairing for these.
They do a lower clutch lever protector which is good as well.
Sato racing also have some awesome rear endurance-style hooks with Delron sliders, which I run.

I also fit the SES Race products fairing bracket and clip-ons. They have some good footrests as well, but I'm waiting for a set, so can't comment on them, even though they look really good in photos...

I have some Vortex rearsets at the moment, and they are perfect. Same with the fuel cap.

If you don't run the YEC CDI and loom, consider spending some time and getting all the wiring in from behind the fairing panels, where it's really exposed.
Clever-Wolf racing in Japan have some pricey but good fairing brackets which allow you to relocate the CDI and regulator, and they do some fairings with PIAA endurance lights pre-fitted. They make all the YEC Racing fairings.


Try to run smaller rear sprockets, 44, 45, 46 and at the most 47, and smaller front sprockets, 15, 16 and occasionally 17. The bigger rear sprocket gives too much centrifugal effect, and at tracks like Assen will make high-speed angle changes difficult.
Work with different length chains to try and keep a constant wheelbase, once you find something that works.

On the older R1's I ran the chain long, going for maximum traction, really working the shock and keeping the bike stable.
With the Crossplane motor, this little puppy has so much traction that I'm starting to run it short, so it's really flickable in the corners.
Start in the middle and experiment once you have the gearing right.
I run 15-45 for Ledenon and 16-45 for Magny Cours, for example, touching the red just before braking for Adelaide. 16-44 works well, too, with a tailwind.

You have less chain effect with smaller sprockets, as well.
I'd try 16-44 for Spa. That should give you La Source in 2nd, but you MAY have to go to first for that stupid chicane though...(I was last at Spa in 2007, so maybe it's changed again ?)

Try the full Lazer system. It's got a nice exhaust note, not too loud, and has similar power to the Akra, but at half the price.
It's mainly better heat dissipation that should govern the choice of exhaust. The Akra is awesome if you're planning on tuning, and it's the best quality bar-none, but the Lazer and Leovinci are both good too.
Still, the standard mufflers are really light, and should be available cheap S/H, so that's an option too.
If you run a Lazer with the standard CDI, keep the lambda, or blank it off and run a PC V.
Fit the YEC AIS plug set. I use the genuine YEC part because it's cheap, it's great, and it works. :boobies

Silicone coolant hoses are a good thing as well, less cavitation at high RPM, and a bit lighter too.

The Starlane GPS laptimer is quite good, eliminates the need for a beacon, otherwise the XT Racing GPX Pro GPS lap timer is great.
I'm counting my cents for a GET Data MD3 dash and full logging system, because I just can't resist beautifully made Italian electronics....and the 2D people have missed the point about "cost-effective entry-level data-logging":hammer:

Hope that helps !
You'll love the sound of the engine as you drop it down two gears for La Source hairpin then pin it on the fast descent past the old pitlane and bottom it out at Eau rouge, before firing it up the hill wide open, front wheel skimming the track cranked over and marveling at how much traction this thing has got...:rock

 

Great thread!

 

interesting reading :corn

 

+1, this is a great thread. I add to it but technically I'm challenged, can only add regarding the handling and power on the track.

 

:bs: Kenny you're technically drunk... but real smooth... :fact :hellobye

 

John you always make me laugh my ass off Bro! :fact :lol

All kidding aside this is the best thread I've read in months on the 09' . Crossplaner, if you ever want track feedback on a currently stock (not for long) 09' I'll be glad to provide any info needed, even though it doesn't look like it.

 

really nice thread :fact :bow

 

I seen yo style Kenny, ridin and drinkin.:fact

:lol

 

Never ever on the track :fact Now the Gap, maybe a little different

 

excellent thread.
I am also having a problem with my cooling on the track and always have to leave the fan on otherwise the coolent overflows once in the pits.
I am running a 15, 46 - but that is all determined by the track. I need to add an additional radiator as well. I have the US version bike and also need to get the UK ECU.

 

Shaun, go the YEC kit box and loom route if your R1 is a dedicated track bike.
It's simple, cheap and it works, and once you figure out what all the little bells, buttons, lights and whistles do, it's damned effective, too.
As Churchill may have said, if he'd owned a 2009 R1, "Never has so much pointy-edge technology been available to so many for so little..."

Otherwise for the European spec, you'll need another top yoke, the dash and the three keys, ignition box, and check the harness is the same, as well as the antenna and steering lock.
I've seen this stuff advertised on e-bay and similar over here, and most people want more than a YEC kit for it.....:hammer:

BTW, Sebastian Gimbert on the Guyot Moto Team R1 clinched the French Superbike title this weekend at Albi, in cool but fine conditions.
All the R1's ran well against some pretty stiff competition.
Gimbert's main protagonist for the title, Vincent Philippe, took himself and the LMS Suzuki out of the running by beating himself up in a warm-up crash, on an early-morning track at 12 degrees Celsius and slippery tarmac. Doh !:flush:

 

What would be a good place to purchase add-on water radiators and oil coolers. Does anyone make this state side or is this all custom add-ons from Europe and Japan?

 

Graves sells the MB motorsports but they are quite hard to get.

 

Welcome to the Forum,
Good Luck in your Races..

+1 good Read!

 

Thanks !

 

Thanks "Crossplaner" looking forward to your review of the RTM product...I will probably end up upgrading the whole set instead of an add-on.

 

that's it, i'm moving back to europe

 

I didn't see any 09' R1's being raced this year in CCS Mid-Atlantic series. I was wondering why. I haven't heard any horror stories about them, but I've heard, out of the box they are not a good race bike. Guys who did race them struggled all year to equal their previous years' lap times. I want to race one next year but am a little hesitant

 

Subscribed.

One of the most technically informative threads I've seen here in quite some time. AWESOME stuff.

Also cool to see you name off a number of companies I sourced while building my R1 a few years ago...Simon, CleverWolf, Febur....just awesome.

 

Dude, your bike is awesome. Some really cool gear, and beautifully put together.
I looked after a few R7's and some R71's for some Dutch and Swiss customers a while ago, and they were great track bikes. I still rate the R7 as having one of the sweetest chassis ever.
Look at picking up a race alternator, if you're using the bike as a track-only tool, because I always felt the engine inertia of the bigger R1 engine caused the bike to run wide.
Or is it an R1 chassis you still have ? Martial Garcia, who develops the Yamaha factory race kits in Europe and ran Yamaha's endurance efforts for years, built quite a few R71's, R7's with R1 motors in them, but the heavier crank took a little bit of the nimbleness away of the R7.

 

:bow:rock

 

hi guys... i'm from INDIA
and this is for all the R1 owners. biking is very different in india and the standards here is still primitive here compared to the west. but superbikes are coming india's way. but we have to pay a little more than double of what you guys pay. for example: i paid close to $30,000 for a cbr1000rr.
now i have already booked the 2010 R1.now reading the various posts about 09 R1 on this forum i'm a bit concerned.09 R1 is reported by many to have various range of problems.
my concern is will it be a GOOD BUY especially after paying almost double the money?

 

It's all relative......you paid double the price for a CBR1000RR, which also has issues. Pick your poison. Further, you don't say what you want to use the bike for. Assuming it's racing/track use, and if it's all about money, then I'd say the GSXR1000R is a safe bet.

 

Well, just back in from three days of thrashing around Mugello.
The R1 was awesome, but needed stiffer springs, at least a 10 or 10.5 on the back, and some 100 Nm on the front to REALLY get it working well.
The radiators from Mirco at RTM worked great, 78 degrees Celsius with 25 degrees Celsius air and 28 degrees track temp, and quite easy to fit, although the front wheel gets AWFUL close (soft springs...) over some of the bigger bumps due to all the F1 testing at Mugello.
Some tweaking got this acceptable, and I'll talk to Mirco about a couple of mm extra of clearance on future radiators.
All in all a great testing session.
A couple of things I found.

Don't gear the bike too low. We ran 16-47 on one and 16-46 on the other, and I think 15-44 would have been good, but we hadn't been delivered the sprockets. 17-47 wasn't bad, but the bike lacked a bit of engine braking to hold the line, engine braking which is modifiable with the YEC box, only my computer bugged on the driver for the YEC USB cable, and all I could do with my computer all weekend was play pinball.....
Ideally the bike wanted to hit the redline at the end of the straight in 6th JUST before shutting down for the braking marker and lobbing it into San Donato. They need to be geared to take full advantage of the huge torque and traction available down low, rather than sitting at high RPM and being pegged for long periods of time. IMHO.

Run the bikes on stiffish springs (one bike was full Ohlins R&T front and TTX rear, the other was on Matris.) I would go 10 kg rear springs for a rider of around 80 kg, with around 15 mm preload, 310 mm shock length on the Matris, to give 14 mm of sag, and I wanted more rear ride height with the Ohlins, but my rider was happy, so he said "Next time..." but I think there was an easy second in having it slightly higher.
Bear in mind the TTX has a top-out spring when setting sag.

I didn't have the front springs I wanted, and although the riders loved the Matris, I felt slightly stiffer springs would have been awesome, with the damping opened back out a bit.
Around 70 laps plus with the tires (Michelin and Pirelli slicks, with a Dunlop front on one bike..) and they looked as good as gold, no sliding, no feathering, and lapping in the top ten with more to come. Fastest time was 1.59, from German Superbike rider Sebastian Diss (strangely, a French guy..) and we were contented pootling around in 2.04's, which I was happy with considering my rider had never seen the track before, and the other rider was coming back from a huge off at Assen earlier on this year, and had never ridden the 09 R1.

The other thing was make sure you have good fairings. My fairings were swelling with the heat and 300 kph wind and ballooning out slightly, forcing the lower belly pan up into contact with the front tire down the straight, due to the fairing flanks not being rigid enough and the belly-pan being too flexible.
That's some scary shit at 300 clicks...
I'm going to shroud the radiators to ensure that there is no extra air getting behind the cowls, and I'll run rear brackets coming down from the footrest plates to lock the belly-pan in place, as well as a front mount which maintains the belly pan's position.
I would like to run the Armour Bodies fairings, but the importer here gives me a pretty crappy price....oh well...

 

Damn... riding at Mugello on a laced out new R1 built just to get at it. Right on :bow:thumbup

 

Crossplaner,do you have any experience with yec suspension(complete forks-not too expensive) for 09 r1

 

No, sorry.
They should be quite good, though.
Of all the Japanese sportsbikes, Yamaha have by far the best out-of-the-box suspension, and they have a lot of clever ideas, so I think it's worth a shot.
you can always sell it and upgrade if it doesn't work out.